RVR new system feedback

[skutrug]

How about a knockdown? That works as an interrupt and with the immunity it won't happen too frequently?

[Tesq]

I have to agree with Tesq in this point: The Knockback on Cannons shouldn't exist. Yes, funneling a keep into eternity is boring and we have to do something about it. But i think this change was simply too much. I always loved that its possible to actually build a sweet tankwall to defend an open gate. We even have collision detection to make this feature possible.
I suggest thinking about a different buff for this siege equipment, I'm sure we could find another solution.

it's not tank wall x se, zerged side ONLY need force multipler which funnel is so if it's used by an inferior number of ppl is ok when it's used by the same number or even bigger it is not.

ah ye i forgot 1 thing, if the zerg is too much it is not even possible reach the keep for def, never tought to tell this but i want back the 3 flag for attack a keep rule that also helped split the zerg.

[dur3al]

I'll just copy paste my post from the Changelog 02/11/2016 thread, and hope that people give it a read and see if it makes sense for oRvR:

The cannon changes should be taken only as one half of the whole. They were intended to be a fallback for any failure on my part, mechanics-wise, to split players up through BOs and supply returning. I've adjusted the lock timer mechanics further to this end.

Currently I think no matter how much you try, you'll not be able to completely disperse players throughout BOs and, in a manner of speaking, break the zerg.

Because its not about game mechanics. People will follow other people and try to use them as meat-shields/diversion - no matter which open oRvR game or mechanic is in place. Its about effectiveness in being able to succeed in killing someone.. so unless you roll a fully solo build, or very good risk/reward class, such as a range dps (currently), or stealth-er burst class, you will follow a zerg in order to be able to kill something and fulfill your role.

If I had to suggest something to help into breaking this, the only thing that comes to mind is if you needed to capture & hold an amount of BOs simultaneously in order to give big rewards - forcing group of players to split up to achieve an objective.

So in an example lets say you've 4 BOs and you need to capture and hold all of them in a window of 2 minutes (estimate, to give some window for reinforcements to arrive), and you've 4 warbands worth of players in one side, and 2 warbands on the other side.

For the high population side, ideally they'd put 1 warband to capture/hold each one BO.
- The counter-play for the less populated side is that they can send their 2 warbands to one of the BOs - and prevent that being captured/held by effectively outnumbering their opponent.
- The counter-counter-play for the high population side is splitting their numbers even more by having half-warband defending each BO, while the rest will roam between in order to try and assist the BO being attacked as quickly as possible, failure in doing so, will see that BO's defenders wiped and the BO lost/locked, now having to wait a certain time until they can do so again - also giving the less populated side more opportunities to repeat their strategy in another BO all the while benefiting from AAO.
- The counter-counter-counter-play for the low population side is splitting their warbands in 2, attacking 2 BOs at the same time increasing their odds for success, or making half a warband attack somewhere as a diversion (or having their best players in it) while the rest effectively attack the unsuspected BO.
- Etc.

This way I think you'd be satisfying everyone:
- The people who enjoy rolling in organized guild warbands, since they'll more often find fights with equal guilds.
- To the guys who enjoy playing solo and rolling with a pug organized warband still feeling very important in accomplishing the objective while communicating with the other warbands and will most likely meet equal opposition.
- There will be plenty opportunities for ganking in a 6 man or less (& solo) as I explained above the higher population side requires to split up quite a lot in order to succeed. While the gankers and 6 man groups from the zerging side can be on the roaming duty effectively killing off the low population side once they hit an BO.
- A kite group (pretty much 9 out of 10 premades out here) will be useful since they're the perfect decoy in attracting attention while some other group is pushing for a BO, they'll feel like they're not only farming kills but participating into the oRvR to their faction, if the opposition defending the BO gets to thin by sending people to another BO, they could actually wipe them and take the BO themselves being even more effective to their realm and reaping the rewards from the BO itself.

If anything i'd leave Keeps out of the equation as a sort of super difficult objective, which is the spawn for everyone in the zone (and can probably have a sort-of portal where all the players from the low population side can go to to defend) which is not involved in the zone locking/rewarding system but if the high populated side still wants to give it a go for some other reason (rewarding very high amount of rp/inf/medallions/titles/cosmetics) they're free to do it at their own peril facing risky cannon/pve odds.
This to me also adds a different flavor to oRvR, imagine back in the day in World of Warcraft that you had your huge cities but you couldn't attack it (off PvP), but in this case you have this super difficult place that if you are strong enough (zergy enough) you can actually take it, but not being part of the general zone locking system reward etc.
So now you can actually boost the defenders ability to defend by a lot, giving the underdog side the help they require when facing higher odds, without being afraid to lock the oRvR into that single spot while also not punishing and keeping the higher population side from their rewards.

So now you've tackled a couple oRvR issues:
- Range being a monster in keep fights.
- Funneling doors.
- Zerg.
- Making BOs meaningful and effectively force oRvR to be about the zone, not about the keep.
- During low population times, people will still be able to lock zones (even if there is no fighting to be had) - these people shouldn't be punished and should still find a way to progress, even if less due low contribution from kills for e.g..
- Promote communication (promote friendship and encourage people to talk with each other), as I showed in the example above, communication will be key in taking a zone, people will even go in as scouts to see enemy movement (promoting splitting).
- Promote realm pride.
- People will make use of the entirety of the terrain to their advantage, groups will even more often use PvE routes to reach BOs unsuspected.
- Fighting all around, as WAR should be, all the while having niche play-styles such as certain groups preferring to fight/defend certain BOs that its terrain friendly with their play style.
- In my opinion, you'll also address cross-realm in a sense, let me explain:
Its about trying to create a 50/50% fight scenario, even if the populations are 150/50, while having good rewards in taking/defending BOs instead of only in the final zone capture.
While the less populated side in this system will hardly ever be able to lock a zone, they'll still get their reward from attacking BOs, and if they frustrate the high population long enough, what will happen (what always happens in RoR) is that people will start changing sides, but as in the example, high population don't bring that huge advantage, and when population shifts, the impact won't be so big as it is now.
- No snowballing with higher numbers into the objectives.

Of course this is an example and I haven't thought about many side effects that i'd be happy to think over if people indulged me, but yeah.. that's how I would like to see oRvR.

The question you've to ask is: is it possible for one faction to roll in a big zerg and do the end objective? If yes, then you'll fall into the same problems as always.
When the answer is that they need to be at different places at the same time, then it'll be a step in the right direction. Even make a check to see if there is at least 5 (# is an example) players in one BO to count as secure, failing to do so it'll count as neutral, that opens opportunity for the underdog side to hit it if they know which BO has the least amount of defenders (scouting suddenly makes sense and is very important, as well as keep tracks of enemy movement, promoting communication).

[KikkL]

Battle objectives

BOs lock for 15mins.
BOs unlock for capture after lock, but remain unclaimed.
If a BO has remained claimed but uncaptured(idle) it becomes claimed.
Claimed BOs are locked for 30mins.
Claimed BOs can be used as travel locations from wc/keep.
If a unlocked claimed BO defends an attack it becomes claimed(30min)
BOs start on reset/open after being claimed.

15Min BO locks, then they unlock for capture if opposing realm doesnt attack within 10min it becomes claimed(30min).
BOs become locked but unlock after 15min for capture.
if a BO hasnt been attack in 10minutes it becomes claimed(30min)
Claimed BOs can be used as travel points.

BOs become claimed after being locked/def.
1lock+def = claim
1lock+autoclaim(idle) = claim.

BO arguement.

This will force players to fight at BOs/keep, especially if all BOs have been taken within 5min of being claimed(30min). It would force confrontations on attk/def of BOs/keep. Traveling to claimed BOs would offer advantage points.
Having a BO be locked twice ensures a defense is necessary, otherwise a autolock(claim) will happen.



Character developement

Every player gets an extra 10/15k hp!
(yes im being serious)

Additional Heath points argument.


Additional health points would allow for more reaction time in both defense/offense.

Each player recieves an additional 10/15k health.
The margin for error is very steep, sometimes there is no margin you have no chance. This should not apply in a group based game. A person should not be able to take you out in seconds. It should take focus fire/effort. It would allow for abilities to be stacked/used together with others, it would provide challanges to better players.
(higher hp is the quickest soluation to survivability/greater depth in playstayle both in/out of group enviroments).



viewtopic.php?f=15&t=18005
is open for discussion or pm me

[Vandoles]

I'll give my 2 cents here on an issue no one is touching upon.

This patch completely kills casual play. Like it or not, War has always been an mmo where you can roll whatever you like, play it however you like. The VAST majority of players in any given mmo either play with a small group of friends or by themselves. Only a minority plays in organized 6-mans, guilds and alliance WBs. However, ever since the battle spread over the map, that's all there is. Now I know very well EVERYONE will disagree with me, because the only people who visit the forums and write here are those that do actually play more hardcore/organized. But the fact of the matter is, there are so much fewer open warbands, casual groups and even less people roaming by themselves, because there's a 6-man around every corner. There is no zerg or pug action in EU prime time in t4. Although that doesn't impact most of you people who are here, dozens of people who either play offspecc characters (and as such are not invited in organized rvr) or want to play more casual are denied the ability to play until eventually someone manages to somehow form an open WB. Although this still happens, it will die down soon almost completely. It doesn't help that it's discouraging russians to mix with others, considering how many russians we have on here and how they didn't want to do that anyway.

I just hope RoR doesn't turn into a hardcore 6-man gankfest featuring only maras, chosens, WL's, KOTBS and healers.

[saupreusse]

May i ask how the last patch did this? I couldnt really find an answer on that in your comment.

[KikkL]

Im getting very sick of how fast you can die. I think this is the reason ive made so many alts and rerolled. There is more gameplay in t1 than t4. Why are people able to knock you out in seconds? Total garbage.

My playtimes are starting to diminish because there is no strategy for some players. Disarm, knockdown, ect ect, time you come out of it your dead. Its awefull. how are you suppose to be able to have a chance if your dead before you can do anything?
how are your teamattes supposed to do anything before your dead?
How is this defined as a group game?

Shouldnt a group game require multiple focus to take you out?
Not 1 person with a few moves. so lame.

[Azarael]

That's great, but... it doesn't have anything to do with the RvR system, does it?

[Akalukz]

the cannons are a bit OP still when one hit can take about 50% of your health due to proximity of others, its just too much in ORvR. last night even after the patch oil was dying extremely fast to oil. I will play again tonight,

[Tesq]

Could ALL sieges weapon be limited to be set near keep? + could aao side get cannons for free at his flags? this would still make cannons anti zerg tools but every dam guild would stop to train them around to just **** everything.