Sc Objectives...

[peterthepan3]

Most people fall into one of three categories: a) they want to 'technically' win, so they'll focus the objective in the hopes of 'winning' the game; b) they want to just engage in a fight and don't care how much they die/who wins/what they're doing/ignore everyone (this is the majority); c) are geared, and only care for PvP.

If we are losing on points badly, we will go for the objective - but we will not prioritise it to such an extent where we are avoiding PvP. Some objective-based maps are INCREDIBLY boring, too, or made worse by the fact that you need some semblance of cooperation between multiple parties (Logrin's Forge) in order to win - and this RARELY materialises.

Personally? I don't really care for objectives, but will do them if it helps the greater good - but I will always look for fights first and foremost. If it happens to be a pug farm(which is sadly 99% of current scenarios), we will just do the objective and get it done. I will always prioritise kills over an objective-based 'win', but I can empathise with your concerns. For what it's worth, even in elitist sadboy 6v6 land, one or two guilds strangely like to prioritise objectives over actual PvP, too, so it isn't just restricted to normal sc.

Pretty much my take on it. I play SC's for small scale fights because the rvr lawnmowers zergs bore me to tears

amen.

[SilverWF]

Sc after Sc Destro goes for kills and chases while Order accomplishes the task undeterred.

This happens at both sides and not only in this game, trust me.
There is always a bunch of selfish or just unexperienced players around in the any MMO.

[Aurandilaz]

Which is more fun, holding an objective and looking useful, or actually enjoying the pvp in a game dedicated to pvp? For emblems, couldn't care less, they keep dropping day after day anyway, you win some you lose some, emblems keep piling up and I have no idea how to spend them (yeah, not all classes enjoy their SC gear).
And if I get less renown because of "technically losing the PVE point race", oh no, maybe I'll get to rr80 1-2 week late somewhere around 2021?

[MedV]

Which is more fun, holding an objective and looking useful, or actually enjoying the pvp in a game dedicated to pvp? For emblems, couldn't care less, they keep dropping day after day anyway, you win some you lose some, emblems keep piling up and I have no idea how to spend them (yeah, not all classes enjoy their SC gear).
And if I get less renown because of "technically losing the PVE point race", oh no, maybe I'll get to rr80 1-2 week late somewhere around 2021?

Yea I guess so. Guess im looking at it from the POV of a Sub40 player. So getting that extra 30k xp from a win is a big deal. But once I hit 40 it prob wont change xp rates by much.

[lata]

I hope that it could be selective when you are choosing sc's. If you want to play for objective select objective based scenarios. If you want to kill select others. Then number of the people can be calculated and change the scenario numbers balance depend on it. If you choose&play others could have some warnings/bans.

I really like team play and i dont like when people go against scenario objectives. On the other hand since this is a game i respect as well. Fallenkazef wrote above he choose sc s for small population fights because of orvr's zerg mentality right know, which is super understandable.

So again a separation at the start can be good.(i am not sure if this is doable - just an idea)

keep up the good work
cheers

[Skalier]

Make Battle Objectives healing points.

"Premade" when one snared you in place, second knock you down and 4 kick when you are lying on the ground is bad association and should be unacceptable.

I know it will not be changed so even though we can give PUG some chance and can do from Battle Objectives some healing points..

[peterthepan3]

"Premade" when one snared you in place, second knock you down and 4 kick when you are lying on the ground is bad association and should be unacceptable.

get gud and form a group.

[anarchypark]

everyone have different definition of fun.
it's like debating which flower is most beautiful.

even in this same game ppl play differently.
let me list their genres.
there are FPS snipers, duelers of fighting game, RPG roleplayers, RTS tacticians, PvE farmers, almost all type of genres except gambling.
orvr is melting spot of all.
SC is too small and short to melt together completely i guess.

just respect their choices and let them be.
you can't change other's play style. maybe throw advice once or twice.
you call them wrong, they call you wrong, nothing achieved.

this is first step for pug. you are solo.
or get a group with similar minds

[BrockRiefenstahl]

I did quite a bit of T4 PUG scs yesterday. I have lost 80+% of them...

We would do objectives when we wouldnt meet 80% Healer+Tank and ~%dps teams of Destru.
Most of the games we ended up at our Respawn and waited until it was over. There is no point into jumping down and getting fisted so hard by Premades with maybe 1 tank and 1 or 0 healers.

As soon as destru also was in a Pug, chances have been pretty even.
Especially when I saw players like Volgo in our team, then the ranges could finally do their job.
Biggest PUG order problem is lack of tank and healers but also melee. While Destru is 90% frontlinezerg hitting order like a truck and simply overrolls them.

Long story short, as soon as both sides PuG AND Destru team is not 80+% consisting of DoKs and Tanks than order has a very high chance for winning. Even if I often get flames by my own team when calling out for doing objectives etc. I won those matches when players do the task properly. Trivial things like in Serpents Passage, order always makes the same mistake. You can literally say Order is starting the game 0 - 150+ because they come late for the first objective and if they get it, they ALL run with the carry instead of securing the middle. But when you tell them, they most likely listen and win. I prefer to get the occasional flames from uberpro than losing every god damn Scenario for the god damn loser emblem.

Edit: Would also be cool to get some tips from the top players. Because now I level a range character and I know the first seconds of the clash if we win or lose. Because when I see certain Destruction tanks in the enemy team, I can literally do NOTHING. They have such a massive frontline, that noone really can touch their Herlers or sometimes Magus/Sorcs. All you see is Dodge/Disrupt/Evade combatlog and barely any damage. As soon as you try to push a little in, you are dead... I really have no Idea what we can do vs this strong destru PuG constellation because they have so many Melees + Healers.

[bwdaWAR]

First of all, just to repeat what several people said here before: try the other side, you'll have the exact same problems, such as constantly facing premades with your PUG, no healers, no tanks who Guard or any form of cooperation.

As for the topic at hand, this came up several times in the past and it always reminded me of a certain game called Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory. It came out in an era when the objectives of almost all multiplayer games of the genre were "capture the flag" (often no more than a better spawn point) or just "kill the enemy team", and it features a complicated series of objectives for almost all the maps that you must perform in order to win. And it was very enjoyable, while that opinion being obviously a personal taste thing, its popularity was big and lasting enough to show many others shared it (as far as I know, there were still servers for it a few years ago).
The point here being that what people have often repeated, that basically boils down to "objectives are boring, killing is the only fun" is just not true, unless we're talking about a player with a very short attention spam. Now I'm well aware that WolfET was a different genre (FPS) and it was basically in perma-"scenario" mode, no realms and so forth, but it demonstrates that objectives can be incorporated into a smarter gameplay where fighting the enemy team is just as necessary as other, less objective-oriented games but one also must concentrate on the objectives or the game will end in a draw.
So perhaps the problem isn't with there being objectives at all but their Warhammer Online implementation that RoR inherited? I don't claim to have the solution for this, but I always felt that the multiple capture-the-flag mechanics don't really encourage fighting for the objectives, nor does deliver objective to somewhere (relatively) safe... or even the carry and hold the objective in the back line. Basically the two teams can and will just ignore the objective completely and fight in the middle of the map while anyone running objectives, be that flags that don't happen to be in the way of the fighting or delivery, will only face ganking if anything.