Magus' Rend Winds ability - How did it work on live?

[Sulorie]

Next AM's want to use their 1sec cast on the move.

[Tesq]

Well let me start off first by saying that I never played a Magus live, but I did start a Magus in RoR and must admit that I liked the way the ability is now. It's a 1 second cast that can in it's current form be cast while moving. The way Mythic implemented didn't make sense at all, similar to the way Auras were implemented in Vanilla WAR.

The ability is a 65 yard ability so it's not like it has a huge range, similar to skirmish abilities for SH and SW. Also if you do move, that means you probably move away from your daemon which will reduce the damage you do. It's a good ability that is situational depending on what is happening in the battle.

I would also change Engy's mirror ability to the way Rend Winds currently works, but I understand if the people in RoR don't want to change class mechanics so early on in the game. After all it could have repercussions as the game moves on from tier to tier and create imbalance. I'm just saying that if Auras were changed to their current form, maybe it's okay to have this ability stay in it's current form as well?

It's a topic that should definitely be open for discussion.

I have to agree

[magter3001]

Next AM's want to use their 1sec cast on the move.

I said to open it for discussion, and I listed my own pros and cons for it if you read my entire post. I know that every class wants a little something extra but the ability in it's current state makes sense. So long as we monitor it from Tier to Tier and if need be make adjustments.

I also said that engys would have to get their equivalent to Rend Winds to do the same to balance the factions. Both Magus and to a lesser extent engys were one of the least played classes, definitely the least dps class played for many reasons.

Again, I think it's a good idea to discuss this first before making changes, similar to the Auras discussion.

[Sulorie]

The range is no problem, when you're not prime target. It is spirit damage and the main single target rotation is elemental damage, with only one spirit damage ability (IFoC). Because of that you hardly use it.
The skill itself is fine, giving higher damage for shorter range.

Some melee magus might use it, as their attacks are based on spirit damage.

[Zxul]

Back on live it was a "spam" nuke, with slightly higher dps (and cost) then Flickering Red Fire, and lower range. In other words, I don't remember ever using it- when spiking in melee range I would rather use all the heavy nukes from Havok with a 50% cast time (from Close Quarters tactic), or Daemonic Maw (much better dps), when running after somebody its not worth wasting 1 sec to stop and cast a short range nuke, which will probably won't go off anyway since target will be out of range- when if I stop i can cast Bolt of Change, which hits much harder and has over x2 range.

Basically only useful when you want a constant prolonged dps without running out of AP- in other words, when killing oil :p- and Flickering Red Fire works much better for it.

Only use I can see for Rend Winds is to trigger some procs (if each hit actually has a separate trigger chance) from items or such. Say magus with influence staff trying to kite, or such.

[magter3001]

Back on live it was a "spam" nuke, with slightly higher dps (and cost) then Flickering Red Fire, and lower range. In other words, I don't remember ever using it- when spiking in melee range I would rather use all the heavy nukes from Havok with a 50% cast time (from Close Quarters tactic), or Daemonic Maw (much better dps), when running after somebody its not worth wasting 1 sec to stop and cast a short range nuke, which will probably won't go off anyway since target will be out of range- when if I stop i can cast Bolt of Change, which hits much harder and has over x2 range.

Basically only useful when you want a constant prolonged dps without running out of AP- in other words, when killing oil :p- and Flickering Red Fire works much better for it.

Only use I can see for Rend Winds is to trigger some procs (if each hit actually has a separate trigger chance) from items or such. Say magus with influence staff trying to kite, or such.

That's why I say it's a good situational ability in it's current form. It's a pure kiting ability as it is right now with decent damage and range, and as you said it's good for triggering procs.

[Tesq]

Well a good pros is that you can debuff spiritual damage this make you able do 2 combo

elemental damage combo while stationary (pet debuff + red fire + 20% buff damage from Daemon)
spiritual damage combo while kite/moving (clean magic + rend winds + no pet buff while moving)

it seems a good tool to me on magus while not "good" as main combo still give magus some versatility.

Does Engi have the same type of debbuff on his stationery combo on turret?

EDIT:
Just i found that this would lead to a melee combo that cost 5 ap
http://waronlinebuilder.org/#career=mag ... :5100:5101:

Basically spam that skill under 45 feet make you a melee that does spiritual damage and even debuff spiritual resistence. Being those 3 different hit each can proc the tactic so basicaly when you are out of 45 feet your skills cost 5ap due have 1 sec cast. When you are inside 45 feet it have 0.5 sec of cast time and so no global coldown as cast time cover that, then cost 5ap 1/2 fo times more or less, also with both other 2 tactic you have a inc/out-coming damage increase for a total of 30%.
If that skill goes to cast while move maybe would be better add 1 sec coldown so that even with tactic it still has a global coldown and cannot be spam for a total of 6 hit in 1 sec with debuffed spiritual with a 30% damage increase.
They would be 6 hit that does spiritual damage and enemy would have x debuffed value ( same value of auras ) in spiritual resistence.

[magter3001]

Well a good pros is that you can debuff spiritual damage this make you able do 2 combo

elemental damage combo while stationary (pet debuff + red fire + 20% buff damage from Daemon)
spiritual damage combo while kite/moving (clean magic + rend winds + no pet buff while moving)

it seems a good tool to me on magus while not "good" as main combo still give magus some versatility.

Does Engi have the same type of debbuff on his stationery combo on turret?

EDIT:
Just i found that this would lead to a melee combo that cost 5 ap
http://waronlinebuilder.org/#career=mag ... :5100:5101:

Basically spam that skill under 45 feet make you a melee that does spiritual damage and even debuff spiritual resistence. Being those 3 different hit each can proc the tactic so basicaly when you are out of 45 feet your skills cost 5ap due have 1 sec cast. When you are inside 45 feet it have 0.5 sec of cast time and so no global coldown as cast time cover that, then cost 5ap 1/2 fo times more or less, also with both other 2 tactic you have a inc/out-coming damage increase for a total of 30%.
If that skill goes to cast while move maybe would be better add 1 sec coldown so that even with tactic it still has a global coldown and cannot be spam for a total of 6 hit in 1 sec with debuffed spiritual with a 30% damage increase.
They would be 6 hit that does spiritual damage and enemy would have x debuffed value ( same value of auras ) in spiritual resistence.

That's a good point, having at least some form of cooldown would be good. We don't necessarily want Magus to be better kiters than Squig Herders, we'll just have to see what the devs do. My guess is Aza will make it stationary for the time being in a new hotfix down the line, so I guess I should enjoy the utility as long as I can.

[Azarael]

No further ability modifications will occur until T4, so you are correct in that Rend Winds and Firebomb will be changed to handle as they did on live.

[Kaitanaroyr]

As I recall it:

-Was not castable on the move (same as engi's Firebomb)

-At the end of the full 1s cast, it did 3 hits in quick succession, totalling the tooltip dmg (each with a sep chance to be disrupted/crit/trigger any dmg procs/etc). As opposed to, for example, doing the 3 hits throughout the 1s cast (say, every ~0.33 seconds).

[Original discussion here (pages 11, 12, 13): http://www.returnofreckoning.com/forum/ ... &start=100]

engi's firebomb has always been cast able on the move.