[Suggestion] Making guard less OP

[ThePollie]

Morale damage does not get migitated does it? That is one common way to burst targets down too.

That's not really counterplay, that's just the idea of throwing a planetoid of damage at someone with the idea that they can't physically survive it. Theoretically, you could make a comp with so much damage no amount of guard or defenses would stop you, just odds are you'd never have the sustain to survive long enough to put it into action.

[Marley]

If you could code it make it so that:
More defensive stats, ex. ((Block + Parry + Disrupt)/3) + Base 0 - 25 % -> Base guard 25 - 50 %

AND/OR give DPS a skill that goes through guard for 5 - 10 seconds ?

Might add some dynamics.

Or make custom guards for example:
IB -> 25 % guard from guard, IF oathfriend is on same target + 25 %.

Or something along the lines of that I'm just brainstorming what me and my Bro where talking about.

[Toldavf]

The problem cited with Guard was that it lacks real counterplay outside of superpunts, forcing groups to lean upon those superpunts and overvaluing them.

I'm trying to think of some kind of counter mechanism that doesn't cripple the ability and has a cost somewhere else - and allowing people to stack defense penetrators to weaken the effect of Guard seems like a convenient one.

Does it really need this though? To be honest I don't think so guard is a corner stone mechanic of the game it's the central focus for a tank play both in application of your own and negation of the enemies. If you try to increase the guard damage tanks take all that will happen is you force tank players to become full turtles.

It doesn't add anything to the play it just makes none turtle specs unplayable.

[Soulcheg]

Morale damage can't be blocked, parried, or anything. That's why we have morale push in t4.

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

Didn't see where anyone decided anything.

Additional note: the current build will also allow a tank to defend the Guard damage if he's knocked down. Fixing that.

The numerous suggestions for a change imply that guard will be changed, without any dev asking for proof of guards op'ness.
The additional note confirms a change.

I dont see why guard only has 1 counterplay. Having 3 st dps are more than enough to kill a target through guard right now (healed by 2 healers).
A nerf to guard benefits zerging and rdps, which definitely need no buff.

[Drak]

So the person making the original post asserts that Guard is OP but understands the mechanic so poorly that he thinks it stacks, and now people are suggesting all manner of ways to nerf a core skill of a tank?

[Soulcheg]

Yup.

[dirnsterer]

Morale damage does not get migitated does it? That is one common way to burst targets down too.

That's not really counterplay, that's just the idea of throwing a planetoid of damage at someone with the idea that they can't physically survive it. Theoretically, you could make a comp with so much damage no amount of guard or defenses would stop you, just odds are you'd never have the sustain to survive long enough to put it into action.

It can be used in smallscale fights too if the guarded target seems to be bit too tough. Like people at 20% or so health can still be pumped up to full health if they are guarded and quick coordinated morale burst makes sure they do not. Also movement can be used to counter it too as it is mentioned in this thread a couple of times. It rarely is 2 groups just bashing their faces together till one of them drops.

[ThePollie]

It can be used in smallscale fights too if the guarded target seems to be bit too tough. Like people at 20% or so health can still be pumped up to full health if they are guarded and quick coordinated morale burst makes sure they do not. Also movement can be used to counter it too as it is mentioned in this thread a couple of times. It rarely is 2 groups just bashing their faces together till one of them drops.

Which can be countered by defensive morales, as well. Divine Protection alone can eat three Sever Nerves, and a 2/2/2 party can drop two of those at a time.

[Soulcheg]

That's why you should do proper timing with morales, not just throwing mindlessly them away, that's what they call "teamplay".