The xrealm solution

[Hargrim]

Everyone I've met on this game has xrealmed to underdog to farm aao, especially keep defenses. Never once seen anyone go to winning side. There's no point if you are in a good group that can get kills, they only advantage you get is like what an extra gold bag spawn, and no AAO.

About commitment I thought about that, comparing it to professional sports teams. Obviously you won't see them changing teams mid fight or season, and looking into the psychology of why people root for teams and get engrossed in the roster.

However the problem I have with that is professional games have structure, WAR does not outside of 6v6 scenarios. It's a zerg/numbers game, people don't work together, and everyone's goal is not the same. I personally only care about rr gains, I've become pessimistic about bags in general and don't care. So whether I'm on the winning or losing side matters not, I just want the most kills in the lake. Now someone else's goals might be drastically different.

@Hargrim, i think the only way to approach that is to ask a series of questions. Then answer each and deal with any problems of each. Starting with the root and ending with a cohesive idea in theory that solves it that checks out logically.

The 1st question I guess would be "Is crossrealming really a problem worth fixing" then tons of follow up questions like "why do people crossrealm" to find the cause, then ask how to fix the causes, come up with systems find faults and answers in the system you create. It's something you do with a group of people.

You could internally do that, everyone commenting on everyone's answers and playing devils advocate. For instance let's say someone says instancing the lakes to 4 warbands a side would solve "x" or be a part of a system to solve "x". Then you would have to ask questions like how would you handle overflow, maybe you open new zones. Then you find that people will probably xrealm more because they can't play on one side since it's full.

Personally I think the key to getting people on one side is tying them to thier guild, using rewards handed out per season based on stats tracked like competitive games do today. And then heavily kneecapping loser rewards since people are "stuck" on one side. This will force guilds within the realm to have to actually care and work together to win if they are losing bringing back the realm in sorts. But again, a million holes in that idea that someone could question I would have a hard time answering.

Thanks for taking time to write this down. Some ideas might be worth considering.

[dethrag]

Is xrealming really a problem and if so, in what magnitude? I've seen many people discuss xrealming but I have yet to see any evidence to prove or disprove any of the speculations. I believe that before we continue further speculation or even attempt a solution, we should monitor the player population. We could perhaps log destro and order numbers and observe if any drastic movement in either direction occurs at a time when there are big fights or sieges.

[Rhinochaser]

I don't see any problem with it personally. I like to play on the underdog side because you can do more guerilla stuff with small groups than with a zerg. I'd hate a log out timer because I don't want my play time prohibited by someone else and their idea of what should be "fun" for me. I don't like to play on the side that hits people with the pile o bodies tsunami and does Doorhammer.

There is no more realm pride because there aren't enough players online at any given time. Plus, if there were timers, I'd bet a dollar to a dozen donuts that Destro would always outnumber Order - simply because their side has more aesthetic appeal.

[Glorian]

Is xrealming really a problem and if so, in what magnitude? I've seen many people discuss xrealming but I have yet to see any evidence to prove or disprove any of the speculations. I believe that before we continue further speculation or even attempt a solution, we should monitor the player population. We could perhaps log destro and order numbers and observe if any drastic movement in either direction occurs at a time when there are big fights or sieges.

There is no "good" xrealming to the losers side. Because everyone who switches to the underdog counts as two players whom you have currently to fight against.

I remember an order Siege of KVs Destro Keep. While we gathered there you could see groups of destro appearing one with orange name tag on one of the inner towers like on the enterprise transporter room.
In an instant destro had 16 more players in the keep. And it was in such a short timeframe and coordinated that I don't believe it were people just logging on.

And that doesn't feels right. You worked to get the zone Siege ready and then your Siege gets stopped by people going to the other side. Then the Siege is stopped, whipped, and you can say hello to two more hours in KV.

[navis]

Instead of disconnecting the user why not just apply a debuff which applies a inverse curve of contribution and rewards(rr/xp/inf)? That is why people want to utilize cross realming primarily. The other option is that the debuff would be to only be applied if the Realm is not the dominating one.

People still can have 2 accounts.

That is only a small minority.

[Hargrim]

People still can have 2 accounts.

That is only a small minority.

Why would it be...?

[navis]

People still can have 2 accounts.

That is only a small minority.

Why would it be...?

Because the majority of people value their time and have lives. It's not worth it to those people to spend that much extra time to use multiple accounts.

[Martok]

With all due respect to everyone here, my xrealm solution proposal:

Just ignore it and play the game.

[wargrimnir]

That is only a small minority.

Why would it be...?

Because the majority of people value their time and have lives. It's not worth it to those people to spend that much extra time to use multiple accounts.

It's not a majority of people that would have a second account, but there is a significant number of people with more than one. Particularly when it comes to the more hardcore and influential players in mass RvR. Those 16 players that appear simultaneously in a keep, they're the ones that have multiple accounts most of the time. Those are the people that need to be addressed, and being able to freely use multiple accounts would allow them to ignore most solutions we could bring right now. The VPN market is well saturated with free services, which blocks a second avenue of approach as well.

Implementing an xrealm 'solution' requires it to:
1. Not harm or hinder the majority of the population.
2. Actually be effective towards the groups who would abuse it in the first place.

We can't force an account to declare order or destro, it would harm the majority of people that have chars on both sides, but do not xrealm.
We can't lock an account to order or destro based on their gameplay choices, as those who would xrealm can easily bypass the restriction at this time.

[Dabbart]

^^^ Not to mention it would open up far more avenues for Punishments, and eventual Bans/loss of players. Obviously, they would be appropriate since you would be violating Server Rules, but Jaycub's question, "Is crossrealming really a problem worth fixing" leads to this point. Is Xrealming worth banning/losing players over? Because if you make it a rule, you can guarantee some Human will violate it. And if someone violates a rule, there HAS to be some form of punishment.

@Glorian again though, logging in is not proof of Xrealming. Maybe a WB just crashed, and everyone was relogging?(Which would account for the "timing and coordination" you saw) Maybe they logged out in KV the night before, and just got off work. Not saying it wasn't blatant Xrealming. But logging in at the KV keep isn't proof of anything, other than you left the game with that toon in the Keep or on a BO. Or maybe it was blatant Xrealming. I have seen it in the past.

But in an ORvR game, your argument about their numbers counting as 2 is irrelevant. ORvR mechanics dictate that you fight with the numbers you have against the numbers the enemy has. That's the reason Blobbing is such an efficient strategy in terms of wiping the enemy.

I understand the logic, that Xrealming makes it more difficult to lock a zone, I just disagree that increasing the resistance is a bad thing. Yea, people want their loot. But they want their loot so that they can fight. Any change that limits the potential for Fights, and would even actively punish people for attempting to do so(again, justifiably if there was a Rule against it) is bad imo.

Also, I believe a LOT of these issues will be resolved if/when Guilds have some ability to claim Keeps or climb a Ladder of some type. As it stands, literally the only reason to play is for a good fight, and to accumulate the RR/gear you need to compete in them.

Edit: words...