[Scenario] Emblem reward system

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

You can increase the reward to over9k, if nobody queues, nobody is rewarded.

If you have higher incentive to group up and pvp... yet people would rather not do it... that should tell you something wingz.

At the end of the day - your position against this is laughable. If you really wanted competitive pvp - why are you even playing WAR? There is no ladder here, no ELO, no tournaments, nothing.

Oh yeah, i forgot. You play here in this small 1000 capped server, because it allows you to farm pugs on a Swordmaster/BO and then proclaim that it is actually a better tank than kotbs/chosen because you know - u farmed pugs on it.

laughable. i can understand your desire to be a big fish in a small pond..but you are delusional if you think that it means anything.

I understand why you are so salty, being in a premade and losing to pugs is bitter. Experienced it myself once or twice.
Anyway, WAR was somehow competitive. Any argument why RoR cant step up to that? The balance will be better it is the mindset of the majority that lacks the competitive spirit. Mostly because you can get stuff without effort.

Imagine all the pugs that will never experience a great coordinated skirmish fight, the essence of WAR, which is balanced around grps.
Not 1on1. And for sure not wb vs wb, back on live, the original devs participated in a city siege and got melted by bomb wbs leading to a nerf in bombing. So I guess wb vs wb wasnt their goal to balance for.

How would a pug vs pug sc promote grp play? It will be chaos like it always is. But being constantly stomped by premades will get some players to build their own. Resulting in 6 pugs less and more fun for everyone.
No need to build a grp? No grps. That is how it turns out.

[TenTonHammer]

Well I'm glad geni came in, the fact that solo que and other stuff is in the works can put this argument to rest

It's happening and we have to accept it

So guilds will be sad becuse they can't get their kicks 6v10ing an entire sc party but in the grand scheme of things this might be for the best

[mursie]

How would a pug vs pug sc promote grp play? It will be chaos like it always is. But being constantly stomped by premades will get some players to build their own. Resulting in 6 pugs less and more fun for everyone.
No need to build a grp? No grps. That is how it turns out.

friends play together on this game. As such, they will group up...be it duo/trio/quad/quint or even 6 man groups. When they do...they will que for ALL the other sc's that aren't solo pug and they'll get to enjoy that magical world of grouping you talk about. That isn't going to die.

Seriously - are you trying to debate that if we implement ONE sc that is pug only...at HALF the rewards... that all other pops will die?

If that is your argument, then you are admitting that the entire population is casual pugs. Which then takes me back to my last post - wtf are you even doing here? Are you that insecure that you need to farm an entire population of self admitted casual pugs and can't be bothered by any compromise or solution at all?

But we know this isn't the case. people like to group up and will group up. Yes - the epeen 6v6 sc will be a total flop. I know this and you know this. But the ALL other sc's que will be just fine... and people pugging in solo que will meet others or guild up or whatever...and they will join that ALL other sc's que at points in time as well.

[peterthepan3]

Provided this one scenario (which will pop 10x faster) has lowered rewards, I don't think anyone would mind What's that? You demand to get the same rewards as people who put effort into group vs group PvP? Make a group then! Simple - everybody is happy. I'd have thought that the recent scen changes (penalising solo players in scens) would have given some people an inkling.

and i wouldn't knock the 6v6 premade scenarios just yet. i anticipate a lot of people queuing for them (win or lose) because this is the sort of PvP a lot of us enjoy more than any other in this game, and want some competitive fights. Heck even if the waiting time is 10minutes, it's not that bad - providing the pugs aren't reaping all the same rewards! I jest.

[mursie]

I anticipate a lot of people queuing for them (win or lose) because this is the sort of PvP a lot of us enjoy more than any other in this game, and want some competitive fights.

We'll see - give it a month. Alot of bravado on the internet. None the less.. i hope you are right and get what you want. I am not wanting to limit your experience and an sc that allows you the avenue to test your mettle directly against another 6 man premade without any bs pug interference... is a good thing.

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

How would a pug vs pug sc promote grp play? It will be chaos like it always is. But being constantly stomped by premades will get some players to build their own. Resulting in 6 pugs less and more fun for everyone.
No need to build a grp? No grps. That is how it turns out.

friends play together on this game. As such, they will group up...be it duo/trio/quad/quint or even 6 man groups. When they do...they will que for ALL the other sc's that aren't solo pug and they'll get to enjoy that magical world of grouping you talk about. That isn't going to die.

Seriously - are you trying to debate that if we implement ONE sc that is pug only...at HALF the rewards... that all other pops will die?

If that is your argument, then you are admitting that the entire population is casual pugs. Which then takes me back to my last post - wtf are you even doing here? Are you that insecure that you need to farm an entire population of self admitted casual pugs and can't be bothered by any compromise or solution at all?

But we know this isn't the case. people like to group up and will group up. Yes - the epeen 6v6 sc will be a total flop. I know this and you know this. But the ALL other sc's que will be just fine... and people pugging in solo que will meet others or guild up or whatever...and they will join that ALL other sc's que at points in time as well.

At least we agree on 6vs6 scenarios being a flop.
But, if the pug vs pug sc is not limited in some way, what will prevent (lets take your number) 90% of the people to just queue for that one, since they are guaranteed a "fair" fight?
If you make 1 pug vs pug sc pop every 10mins, serverwide, I think the other scs get some love, otherwise you just lose 10% of the whole population together with 90% of the skill to another game.

[mursie]

But, if the pug vs pug sc is not limited in some way, what will prevent (lets take your number) 90% of the people to just queue for that one, since they are guaranteed a "fair" fight?

As someone that plays in premades every night... I could not in good conscience advocate no change if truly 90% of the population prefers the solo que - even at the detriment of my ability to que as a group with active pops.

I guess that is our fundamental difference. I do not think this change will severely impact group play or your experience... but if it did... it would mean that the mass majority of this game do not play it as you (and I at NA primetime) do. For that reason alone, they should be given the opportunity to enjoy the game the way they play it, with a "fair" fight. They should not be forced to my minority position because my minority position might be inconvenienced with longer que times if a change is made.

[skutrug]

Well, sometimes I feel like grouping, and sometimes (late at night) I feel like getting in a chaotic scrum with a bunch of puggies... So I am happy to hear that those choices are in the planning. Regarding the potential empty queues... WAR players have proven over and over that they respond very well to rewards - make the scenario with a slow queue award x2, x3, x5 the number of emblems... and people will queue.
Cheers

[DefinitelyNotWingz]

But, if the pug vs pug sc is not limited in some way, what will prevent (lets take your number) 90% of the people to just queue for that one, since they are guaranteed a "fair" fight?

As someone that plays in premades every night... I could not in good conscience advocate no change if truly 90% of the population prefers the solo que - even at the detriment of my ability to que as a group with active pops.

I guess that is our fundamental difference. I do not think this change will severely impact group play or your experience... but if it did... it would mean that the mass majority of this game do not play it as you (and I at NA primetime) do. For that reason alone, they should be given the opportunity to enjoy the game the way they play it, with a "fair" fight. They should not be forced to my minority position because my minority position might be inconvenienced with longer que times if a change is made.

I dont doubt that the majority wants rewards for little to no effort, on the other side I highly doubt that a game that gives them rewards for little to no effort lasts very long.

WAR lasted very long, like every game it lost subscibers in the long run, but at the end the population was still decent.
Even with the old pug unfriendly, premade dominated system. I doubt that many people left because they were stomped by premades since it was still ongoing till the very end. People had their carrot on the stick, no matter how hard it was to achieve, those who stayed were many and they tried.

At the moment I see that many advocates of a separated queue are people that hate to die, especially vs people they dont like. Very obvious that it is not about helping out new players/pugs it is about them being able to dominate or at least play with less to no competition/pressure.

[mursie]

At the moment I see that many advocates of a non-separated queue are people that love to farm pugs. Very obvious that it is not about helping out new players/pugs it is about them being able to dominate or at least play with less to no competition/pressure.

Fixed that for you - we can continue this debate ad nauseum if you like. I offer options and compromise. You've offered insults, personal attacks, and fear mongering. I have great hope that those who make decisions on these matters can distinguish the two.