DoK/WP with book/chalice...

[Azarael]

The problem with this is that two of the three paths are based around attacking. The optimal way to reconcile WP/DoK as a class is to bring the casted healing and melee healing paths together to form a healing spec, which can lean either way based on level of mastery in each. That is going to be impossible if people stick to the idea that WP/DoK should backline. There are too many aspects in the class which were designed around the original concept, and if you gut those aspects for Salvation's sake, you make Grace unfixable - but if you buff Grace, you need to understand that Salvation benefits as well.

[Sigimund]

If Salvation WPs got their resource from smite, judgement and supplication rather than the tome what stats/bonus would you put on the tome instead?

[bloodi]

There are too many aspects in the class which were designed around the original concept, and if you gut those aspects for Salvation's sake, you make Grace unfixable - but if you buff Grace, you need to understand that Salvation benefits as well.

I agree but that bears the question, how many things you can tie to "only when using 2h"?

I mean, its just a requirement, ie, you can use this unless you are 2h or you can do things like, if you are using this while 2h, you also get x? I guess the later is possible since the intimidating repent change exists.

To specify, how many of those aspects i was bitching about, being able to cleanse group wide and so on, can we tie to when using 2h only?

[Azarael]

With the ability to modify the client? All of them. Without the ability to modify the client? We cannot prevent a skill from being cast, but we can modify its effects.

[Tklees]

Range reduction on Smite from 50 to 30ft and reducing the amount you receive from each hit, 15, to 10. Would be a start IMO. WPs should have to manage their resources or regen them in melee. That is why they were given armor. The heal range should not be touched as this limits them in viability to other heals. Resource management, so they can't spam group heal, I think is the way to attack the problem.

[bloodi]

Then this mess of change armor/range and so on its pretty unnecesary, we just need to adjust chalice/tome to the level of other healers while letting 2h users access to most of the old tools.

Doesnt sound so unfair to me.

[ThePollie]

Range reduction on Smite from 50 to 30ft and reducing the amount you receive from each hit, 15, to 10. Would be a start IMO. WPs should have to manage their resources or regen them in melee. That is why they were given armor. The heal range should not be touched as this limits them in viability to other heals. Resource management, so they can't spam group heal, I think is the way to attack the problem.

My concern about this is it further cripples Sigmar's Shield, which is already virtually counter-viable in its current state.

[Penril]

I believe a Salvation WP should be played in a way that he is forced to stay in the frontline but at the same time he should not have any issues to build resource or heal his group. So i would do something like this: remove +resource from books/chalices, and give them Fueled Fury/Fueled Actions for free.

I would have preferred giving them Charged Fury (so they can pretty much recover all their resources with a good Smite) but Doks don't have an equivalent.

[Azarael]

Smite is already good. The last thing it needs is to be even more of an excellent resource generator which conveniently doesn't require you to actually melee anything, just run in and throw it out from 40ft and run back again.

[mursie]

Range reduction on Smite from 50 to 30ft and reducing the amount you receive from each hit, 15, to 10. Would be a start IMO. .

interesting - i was thinking the opposite regarding RF.

I agree that range of heals should be cut. this brings the WP to the front line in order to group heal. The issue is - supplicating on the front line is a very easy maneuver to interrupt via tank/mdps... and once that occurs the WP/DOK with all that fancy armour really does suffer.

My idea:

tone down the tomes/chalice RF regen. like 1/2 so a purple is 4 RF.
cut heal range down to 80/50.

Now the WP must be in melee range to heal and his resource pool while functional - is not strong enough to sit lazy and just group heal. the WP MUST use melee abilities like smite and the aoe melee heal. But - currently those abilities really don't regen RF solid enough so the RF nerf and range nerf would really cripple. If you made smite and the melee aoe heal give solid RF regen... then you'd have what you want. a front line healer - durable enough to actually stand in there and land some blows... with the requirement from heal range to actually do so.... and the resource regen tools via the melee abilities to actually be able to throw out the heal abilities.