Any chance for pugs vs pugs in Cities?

[jaxamillian]

As a mainly solo player I always pug for cities, unfortunately 90% of the time we face up vs perfect premades.

Now I'm down with getting completely shafted up my rear end over and over. But I had a suprisingly excellent idea, how about matching pugs with pugs? That way we could have a chance above 0.0001% of winning with our 3 healers and 14 shadow warriors.

Love the server and appreciate you guys, but pugs vs pugs would be great

[Vayra]

Not gonna happen I'm afraid. For one, city is end-game content and as such should encourage grouping up. And secondly, destro can't queue solo for cities atm as even full wb's aren't guaranteed a pop. Adding a solo queue there would only make that problem worse and punish people for putting in effort and grouping up.

[mytreds]

Unlike other mmos, it really helps to find an established guild or two and do 6 mans or be in a full wb for cities. If Order is to actually get better as a side, they need to ditch the me-only solo attitude and group up. We are only as strong as our weakest links.

[normanis]

u can join 12 in city siege to get pop. its not order fault , that there is more destro que than order.

[Wam]

Unlike other mmos, it really helps to find an established guild or two and do 6 mans or be in a full wb for cities. If Order is to actually get better as a side, they need to ditch the me-only solo attitude and group up. We are only as strong as our weakest links.

+1

There is plenty of well established order guilds always looking for players... but alot of orderlings have the solo mentality then complain when they get crushed by enemies who are working as one cohesive "team". Its a mmo people should join guilds and get involved.

[Aethilmar]

A completely random queueing matching system would certainly alleviate some of the PUG vs premade issues and the meta vs non-meta issues while not addressing the population issues.

However, as noted this is an MMO and a gear grind MMO at that. The established guilds (side doesn't matter) don't actually want "fair" matches. They want to maintain easy farms for gear. Gloating about crushing PUGs or non-meta groups is just a bonus.

[Wam]

A completely random queueing matching system would certainly alleviate some of the PUG vs premade issues and the meta vs non-meta issues while not addressing the population issues.

However, as noted this is an MMO and a gear grind MMO at that. The established guilds (side doesn't matter) don't actually want "fair" matches. They want to maintain easy farms for gear. Gloating about crushing PUGs or non-meta groups is just a bonus.

yeah thats why we went order to face all destro premade guilds with our alts and balance things out (when most wasnt even in vanq gear), meanwhile letting order groups gear up and get a advantage over our destro chars

I like consistencey and fairness... are cities enjoyable? yeah when they are even and you actually have to work for it and can be eitherway... but they more inconsistent on destro side because of order put zero effort into making groups... im not going to complain about beating a group that is going to bring broken composition, i am not going to gloat about it either, no need to gloat period... you can only beat whats infront of you just like in orvr.

"fair matches" would be pugs that get roflstomped learning from mistakes and atleast trying to improve their compositions and teamwork and try improve their level of play...

Why do you try paint guilds are the big bad guys? when its the stubborn/ignorance/laziness of pugs who want to be competitive without putting in any work... if destro pugs can do it, why not orders...

[CountTalabecland]

I think the “its endgame so you should grp” argument falls apart when bringing an organized warband often turns into pulverizing pugs and PvE for free royals crests. Its endgame content so shouldn’t you actually be challenged?

I think PuG/Organized needs to be separated or ability to queque PuG/solo needs to be removed. Most of the royals I have come from times where we just murdered the other side and I got to free dps for an hour and profit while not even trying.

The problem is that most city matches are just slaughters one way or the other with no real challenge after the first fight at mid decides who is stronger.

[Vayra]

I think the “its endgame so you should grp” argument falls apart when bringing an organized warband often turns into pulverizing pugs and PvE for free royals crests. Its endgame content so shouldn’t you actually be challenged?

I think PuG/Organized needs to be separated or ability to queque PuG/solo needs to be removed. Most of the royals I have come from times where we just murdered the other side and I got to free dps for an hour and profit while not even trying.

The problem is that most city matches are just slaughters one way or the other with no real challenge after the first fight at mid decides who is stronger.

How do you define pug vs premade though? Is a 12 man a premade? A 6 man? Also, is a full warband from /5 a premade? It's in no way comparable to a guild/alliance premade so if they count as a premade you're discouraging people from putting in effort and encouraging them to go solo. Also how would you deal with an imbalance of premades? If order has 3 premades but destro 5, do you just not give 2 destro premades pops? Or do you put them in against pugs anyway? In that case, why separate at all?

[CountTalabecland]

I think the “its endgame so you should grp” argument falls apart when bringing an organized warband often turns into pulverizing pugs and PvE for free royals crests. Its endgame content so shouldn’t you actually be challenged?

I think PuG/Organized needs to be separated or ability to queque PuG/solo needs to be removed. Most of the royals I have come from times where we just murdered the other side and I got to free dps for an hour and profit while not even trying.

The problem is that most city matches are just slaughters one way or the other with no real challenge after the first fight at mid decides who is stronger.

How do you define pug vs premade though? Is a 12 man a premade? A 6 man? Also, is a full warband from /5 a premade? It's in no way comparable to a guild/alliance premade so if they count as a premade you're discouraging people from putting in effort and encouraging them to go solo. Also how would you deal with an imbalance of premades? If order has 3 premades but destro 5, do you just not give 2 destro premades pops? Or do you put them in against pugs anyway? In that case, why separate at all?

Yes, anything other than auto-queque like a pug scen. So long as its 6 man or larger and 2,2,2 would mostly fix the issue. Order has been full of brainless rdps bots just clicking the join scen button for over a decade. Yes they are idiots but at some point stop enabling them.

And yes those 2 should be excluded rather than winning the competition lottery against pugs. That’s why forts have caps and exclude overpopulated realm. Go play the underdog. The current system is largely giving away endgame gear by the bucketload of at least 9x royal per match meanwhile pre-fort keeps and forts are true competitions and hours long struggles for between 2-6 Invader.