Increase Order Tankmodel size by 10% - I have the Power!

[jokerspsycho]

Swordmasters are not "wearing dresses" and that sentiment just seems immature to me.


One question that I have been wondering is. If melee dps, especially aoe specs, were either toned down or maybe even just a smaller aoe cap. Would the larger percent of destro tanks matter as much. The data that was in the other thread indicated that choppas were played quite a lot, and currently the meta is all about melting people with a mass of aoe spam. If there was less aoe or a smaller cap, would this reduce the efficacy of melee trains and BW bombs, and create more space for different warband compositions and help ranged classes not be deleted the second an mdps get withinn 40ft.

Battle dress, war skirt, long battle kilt, whatever you want to call it to make it sound ok to you.

So if both sides have aoe, why does one side have a larger population of tanks than the other?

As a WH I'm all about less aoe since that would make me less likely to melt in a blob, but most things I hear from order players is to make the tanks on order more desirable, not make its dps less desirable.

[drmordread]

I bet you would judge Yoda by his size would you not?

[Kwatchi]

I can maybe see this for IBs. We lose sight them in crowds all the time.

SM and KoBS seem fine to me, and are fairly popular amongst Order players tbh.

[TimOh]

Data reference pictures, these were from the debate of order thread. These images are not mine, and the work done to gather data and compile it is awesome. Credit to whoever that was since I wasn't paying attention to the original posters name.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Swordmasters are not "wearing dresses" and that sentiment just seems immature to me.


One question that I have been wondering is. If melee dps, especially aoe specs, were either toned down or maybe even just a smaller aoe cap. Would the larger percent of destro tanks matter as much. The data that was in the other thread indicated that choppas were played quite a lot, and currently the meta is all about melting people with a mass of aoe spam. If there was less aoe or a smaller cap, would this reduce the efficacy of melee trains and BW bombs, and create more space for different warband compositions and help ranged classes not be deleted the second an mdps get withinn 40ft.

Battle dress, war skirt, long battle kilt, whatever you want to call it to make it sound ok to you.

So if both sides have aoe, why does one side have a larger population of tanks than the other?

As a WH I'm all about less aoe since that would make me less likely to melt in a blob, but most things I hear from order players is to make the tanks on order more desirable, not make its dps less desirable.

I would just call what the swordmaster wears armour, no need to make the attempt to apply gendered stereotypes to what they wear. But this particular part of the discussion will probably be unproductive so we can agree to disagree I think, since the main focus is elsewhere.

My statement was not about making order dps less desired, making order tanks more desired or even making destro tanks less desired. I am wondering if there is a correlation between the large amount of aoe, especially in regards to destro mDPS as Mara, choppas and mSH's exist in larger numbers as relative to the amount of slayers order has, and the amount of destro tanks that exist. Aoe is currently the king of rvr, destro has more aoe mdps capability. This leads to more melee trains for destro. The larger number of players playing these melee dps classes means that even in a casual setting like pug warbands there will be more melee trains. Sure there could be a larger population choosing certain destro classes based on appearances.

But my question is, if aoe dps especially in regards to mdps aoe was toned down, would it matter as much that there are more destro tanks? In addition, if mdps and or aoe dps, was toned down in general would there be more warband compositions that could be played other than aoe bomb warbands. Does having only one "competive" style of warband play, aoe bombing, and the higher number of viable aoe destro mdps contribute directly to the problem of order tank numbers.

[jokerspsycho]

Data reference pictures, these were from the debate of order thread. These images are not mine, and the work done to gather data and compile it is awesome. Credit to whoever that was since I wasn't paying attention to the original posters name.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Swordmasters are not "wearing dresses" and that sentiment just seems immature to me.


One question that I have been wondering is. If melee dps, especially aoe specs, were either toned down or maybe even just a smaller aoe cap. Would the larger percent of destro tanks matter as much. The data that was in the other thread indicated that choppas were played quite a lot, and currently the meta is all about melting people with a mass of aoe spam. If there was less aoe or a smaller cap, would this reduce the efficacy of melee trains and BW bombs, and create more space for different warband compositions and help ranged classes not be deleted the second an mdps get withinn 40ft.

Battle dress, war skirt, long battle kilt, whatever you want to call it to make it sound ok to you.

So if both sides have aoe, why does one side have a larger population of tanks than the other?

As a WH I'm all about less aoe since that would make me less likely to melt in a blob, but most things I hear from order players is to make the tanks on order more desirable, not make its dps less desirable.

I would just call what the swordmaster wears armour, no need to make the attempt to apply gendered stereotypes to what they wear. But this particular part of the discussion will probably be unproductive so we can agree to disagree I think, since the main focus is elsewhere.

My statement was not about making order dps less desired, making order tanks more desired or even making destro tanks less desired. I am wondering if there is a correlation between the large amount of aoe, especially in regards to destro mDPS as Mara(wearing a skirt eh?), choppas and mSH's exist in larger numbers as relative to the amount of slayers order has, and the amount of destro tanks that exist. Aoe is currently the king of rvr, destro has more aoe mdps capability. This leads to more melee trains for destro. The larger number of players playing these melee dps classes means that even in a casual setting like pug warbands there will be more melee trains. Sure there could be a larger population choosing certain destro classes based on appearances.

But my question is, if aoe dps especially in regards to mdps aoe was toned down, would it matter as much that there are more destro tanks? In addition, if mdps and or aoe dps, was toned down in general would there be more warband compositions that could be played other than aoe bomb warbands. Does having only one "competive" style of warband play, aoe bombing, and the higher number of viable aoe destro mdps contribute directly to the problem of order tank numbers.

I linked that top chart earlier.

Sov gear, https://warhammeronline.freeforumzone.c ... sione.aspx

When you look at the gear between the 2 realms, imo, destros looks 10x better in most of the cases. U also mentioned mara armor, the piece of armor you see on him, and most tanks, is called a tasset.

A tasset is a piece of armor designed to protect the upper thighs of the wearer. The dwarves looks longer because, well, they are small so it covers more of them lol.

Then u look at SM, this woman is wearing a dress. All I'm asking for is some pants with armor on them because when i ask the folks I play with, they say they dislike how the tanks look, that they dont look like tanks, they dislike the armor on them. Those are the reasons. Blork or chosen could likely underperform but people would still likely chose them over a BG (who also wears a dress. Odd..) because, physically, they look more appealing. I also honestly think that if WL wasnt in such a strong position right now, its population wouldn't be where it is.

Wanting pants on my sm It's not about making a gender stereotype (you did that on your own) I said SM, who can be a man or woman, should wear a suit of armor when going into a battle not a battle dress. That, for me and a few others, our tanks look weak and their gear looks meh and if those two aspects werent present we would be much more inclined to roll a tank which had a playstyle we liked.

[Telen]

Are you hinting that des players over compensate?

[Zxul]

As someone watching from a side, yep SM wears a dress no matter how do you look at it.

Actually my problem with trying sorc- you can either play a guy wearing a dress, or a girl wearing pretty much a swimsuit to battles.

[Noslock]

You play stunties and hummies u deserve to be small.Want to be big play black orc.

[TimOh]

Spoiler:

Data reference pictures, these were from the debate of order thread. These images are not mine, and the work done to gather data and compile it is awesome. Credit to whoever that was since I wasn't paying attention to the original posters name.

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Battle dress, war skirt, long battle kilt, whatever you want to call it to make it sound ok to you.

So if both sides have aoe, why does one side have a larger population of tanks than the other?

As a WH I'm all about less aoe since that would make me less likely to melt in a blob, but most things I hear from order players is to make the tanks on order more desirable, not make its dps less desirable.

I would just call what the swordmaster wears armour, no need to make the attempt to apply gendered stereotypes to what they wear. But this particular part of the discussion will probably be unproductive so we can agree to disagree I think, since the main focus is elsewhere.

My statement was not about making order dps less desired, making order tanks more desired or even making destro tanks less desired. I am wondering if there is a correlation between the large amount of aoe, especially in regards to destro mDPS as Mara(wearing a skirt eh?), choppas and mSH's exist in larger numbers as relative to the amount of slayers order has, and the amount of destro tanks that exist. Aoe is currently the king of rvr, destro has more aoe mdps capability. This leads to more melee trains for destro. The larger number of players playing these melee dps classes means that even in a casual setting like pug warbands there will be more melee trains. Sure there could be a larger population choosing certain destro classes based on appearances.

But my question is, if aoe dps especially in regards to mdps aoe was toned down, would it matter as much that there are more destro tanks? In addition, if mdps and or aoe dps, was toned down in general would there be more warband compositions that could be played other than aoe bomb warbands. Does having only one "competive" style of warband play, aoe bombing, and the higher number of viable aoe destro mdps contribute directly to the problem of order tank numbers.

I linked that top chart earlier.

Sov gear, https://warhammeronline.freeforumzone.c ... sione.aspx

When you look at the gear between the 2 realms, imo, destros looks 10x better in most of the cases. U also mentioned mara armor, the piece of armor you see on him, and most tanks, is called a tasset.

A tasset is a piece of armor designed to protect the upper thighs of the wearer. The dwarves looks longer because, well, they are small so it covers more of them lol.

Then u look at SM, this woman is wearing a dress. All I'm asking for is some pants with armor on them because when i ask the folks I play with, they say they dislike how the tanks look, that they dont look like tanks, they dislike the armor on them. Those are the reasons. Blork or chosen could likely underperform but people would still likely chose them over a BG (who also wears a dress. Odd..) because, physically, they look more appealing. I also honestly think that if WL wasnt in such a strong position right now, its population wouldn't be where it is.

Wanting pants on my sm It's not about making a gender stereotype (you did that on your own) I said SM, who can be a man or woman, should wear a suit of armor when going into a battle not a battle dress. That, for me and a few others, our tanks look weak and their gear looks meh and if those two aspects werent present we would be much more inclined to roll a tank which had a playstyle we liked.

This addresses my critique of how players view the in game models appearance. I didn't say anything about whether destro or order look cooler than the other. I said that acting as if what the Swordmaster wears is a dress, is, in my view immature. And that this subject is valued too highly as the sole reason for tank population disparities. If people disagree than that is fine. Additionally, I do think it is unfortunate that there are not more options for the SM appearance, or at least in some way to make the armour look more like this.

Spoiler:

However, my question about the correlation between mdps, aoe, and tank ratios was ignored. If the rvr scene was different, less aoe spam, would a disproportionate difference in the faction population of tanks be less of an issue?


p.s. I also edited the post because I stated that I thought this would be an unproductive area of discussion, which conflicted with my egging on about maras.

[MMXX43]

Ofc this is only a game but the Destro Tanks feel bigger, meaner, harder.

Thats because they are ! Its not the aesthetics , its the freaking balance that is broken.