Scenarios (rebirth or return to popularity)

[Aethilmar]

I'm mostly with Morradin on this one. I've always enjoyed joining solo ever since live. The random matchups make things interesting.

Weapons -- sure, why not? I'm not particulary loot motivated but some folks are so go for it.

Guards and Barriers -- The system put in place was an attempt to force people to fight in SCs with the "logic" being that if you had nowhere to run then you had to fight. It was, ofc, flawed from the start and the original designers had it right. Sometimes a group of randoms (or even an actual premade) need a "safe" place to figure out how to fight their opponent more effectively and possibly turn things around.

What has been done has had the opposite effect and, ironically, made the player base skill worse since scenarios are no longer a place where you can experiment and learn in a somewhat controlled environment.

So instead people mindlessly zerg in RvR. Which, to be fair, has been mostly okay for me since it provides lots of easy targets who don't know how to react in a small scale engagement.

[Keula]

I have seen this "return scenario guards" point raised multiple times now and it is still not clear to me how this is going to make any difference.

Yea I have no clue either.
My theory is that a lot of ppl seem to think that scenario=Serpents Passage, nothing else as the guards can rarely do stuff in that scenario and high ground spawn scenarios don't exist in their mind. Which is probably coming from the ring events as killing in that scenario was very effective to get the quest/materials and they remember trying to to solo queue and having a bad time in it due to not grouping up.

[Roids]

I have seen this "return scenario guards" point raised multiple times now and it is still not clear to me how this is going to make any difference.

A clear example of what happens when you have guards can be currently seen in Gates of Ekrund or Reikland Factory. When you're getting stomped hard enough that the enemy team can shove you into spawn, the fact that you can occasionally punt an over-extending enemy into guards makes zero difference to the outcome of the scenario. If you're unable to fight them, then you're unlikely to win unless they just ignore objectives entirely.

If the skill disparity is so severe that they can shove you to spawn, where the guards are, the presence of the guards will make zero difference. People are still going to give up and surrender because you cannot even get out of spawn.

Honestly, it's super easy to explain — anyone with even a tiny bit of game experience should get this. The moment a scenario starts and you notice the enemy team has a premade or two, and your side doesn’t even have a healer? Yeah, at that point, taking the quitter debuff starts to look like a solid life choice.

Especially because there are always those "warband-poisoned players" who just rush in — charging or jumping straight to the flag or the enemy — and die in 2 seconds. Then they start flaming everyone else, asking why no one followed them to the healer, the flag, or whatever their plan was.

As a normal player, you're just sitting there thinking, "Screw this," and you don't even bother leaving the spawn anymore. I'm not here to be a piñata for the enemy team.

That’s why guards are so important — at least you have a safe little corner to cry in while the enemy spawn-camps your whole team.

[nocturnalguest]

All guards should return and grant renown, we've had many debates on that, but unless alot of hard work done for matchmaker its just long overdue.

Today experience. A friend of mine wanted to try out DPS comp but we were just two, within ~10 minutes we build up no voice no MA 6men from /5 and win 8 in a row vs. whatever groups there has been in warfront during EU lunch (ive seen at least 1 6men and at least 3 groups of lesser then 6). There has been no surrenders (!!!) whatsoever and people fight back till the very very end, pulls us or punt into guards, try to fight back at warcamp safety.
It happened because:
- they felt they have impact
- they kill, even if its guards
- they are safe and not farmed on CD like it would happen if there would be barriers and no guards

Now imagine how fiercely they would be playing if they would be getting RR from those kills and how more safely we would play if we knew we will feed them. Sometimes it happens and you cant win an open fight by design. There should be still either comeback mechanics, or something proactive that will motivate you to gank, to play, to go out, to spread out.

Current SC design is utter crap. It cant be worse then it is now, at least i cant imagine such. Thankfully this weekend is a map with guards and no barriers and it feels so much better. Ive had way more fun trying to dodge kd+punts and pull then to watch people under barrier and /wave each other.