Balancing Order Tanks

[Gerv]

So we have I believe found an line for the AoE snare component.
1) Remove the abilities to AoE snare completely or 2) reduce them to 50% up-time. What duration is the question, either 5 with a 10 second cd or 10 with a 20 sec cd. I would lean more towards 5 with a 10 second cd as this provides a bit of variety between classes.

Regarding the Auras, based on Azaeral comment.
- Could the same coding lines that are used to the challenge ability be used to create a "shout". The should could have a range of between 30 or 50ft to ensure that the knight must move around and be direction-ally dependent, possible leading to less automation?
- Could it be coded to only effect group mates or would it have to be a set number of targets within the range?
- A duration of 10 seconds with a 15 second cool down seems fair or should it be a flat 50% up-time, maybe this is again something to be tested and adjusted?
- Additionally, could it be coded to have a within x feet add this value of X and within b feet add this value of Y to bounce off Bloodi's idea or is this too much, maybe this aspect could be tested and then adjusted if required based on feedback of ease to apply buffs/debuffs.

*Do people believe that the values of the auras need to be edited to allow other abilities such as the other healer resist buffs (AM and RP) and SM Nature Blade Stat steal+buff to come into use other than for only possible initiative debuffs or does the possible change to the Knight aura system provide enough of a window for other abilities to be worth using?
I think this is critical, otherwise their bonuses are completely disregarded.

Punts - no-one seems to want to nerf the Knight punt since it requires a tactic slot. So moving to the IB.
Volo, you seem to be sure the current distance is enough. I don't think the video is appropriate, the zealot did little to move away from the dps and tanks coming close and the tanks were really slow to react personally. Even if you punted the target and its tank, what is stopping the 2nd tank from just switching guard. Especially if you have to make a b-line its very clear which target you going to. There are too many other factors in my opinion that need to come together (IB side) or not happen (destro side) for the punt to be effective.
Ideas that have been proposed include:
1) Previously we entertained the idea of a short duration root/un-breakable stagger (dazed after punts haha) on the end of a punt. This would drastically change the punt game it seems a little ott at first glance but would be a way to keep targets out of guard range for that little longer. But I think too strong.
2) Increasing distance - possibly make the angle higher so not to get interrupted but random undulating terrain that seems to plague battlefields.
3) Leave as been.
What do others think of these ideas?
*I agree with the duration of the grudge buffs. This would enable better management on buffs that are inherently unique to the class.

Where does this leave our lovely SM?

[7rere7]

The shout example for auras is nice but if all 3 auras are not activated simultaneously its not worth it.
Auras stats edited to half value but stacks with other buffs .

Tank classes have different types of punts and knockdown ,but their evenly balanced in that area,IB punt is fine.
Characters don't need more handing cap ,such as an additional effects given after a punt to kill target,unless a tactic was designed for it.
Option 3 !

[footpatrol2]

I wouldn't touch this stuff.

[GodlessCrom]

I wouldn't touch this stuff.

@Gerv I think 50% uptime on AoE snare is good. I agree with Volgo, it makes proper snare management more important for tanks, since you then have to manage whom you place your ST snare on.

@aura talk: I saw someone make a proposal where they said auras should be aimed AoE shouts that buff allies in range of them and debuff enemies, so you then have to manage whether or not you want to buff your backline, debuff enemy frontline, debuff enemy backline or buff your frontline. The range of the aoe itself would be suitably short, so that you can't just be slightly near one another and get the buffs.

I also wouldn't mind if single-target buffs were, in general, stronger than AoE buffs of the same type. I am also an Ironbreaker main and therefore biased :p

[spikespiegel84]

I think a lot of you guys simply never played a Chosen. But hey, please nerf it, so maybe this whining will stop.

If you think SM is ****, you guys should play against Wingz and tell me the same.

He's gud. And many others. If there is a tank that needs balance in a positive way, that is blackguard.

[Alex1905]

BlackGuard ,Black Orc don't have a 25% parry ability ,the IB does but it cost 15 grudge and last only 10sec and its placed on the least utilized tree ,so its fine.

KotBS have runefang tactic : increasing strength and weapon skill by 240 . Giving shield spec damage on par with 2h damage.

SM,Chosen 25%parry ability should definitely be reworked .

BG has Elite Training (allows you to easily Parry the next 4 attacks)
Bork has weapon skill buff (+% some parry)

[Eathisword]

BlackGuard ,Black Orc don't have a 25% parry ability ,the IB does but it cost 15 grudge and last only 10sec and its placed on the least utilized tree ,so its fine.

KotBS have runefang tactic : increasing strength and weapon skill by 240 . Giving shield spec damage on par with 2h damage.

SM,Chosen 25%parry ability should definitely be reworked .

BG has Elite Training (allows you to easily Parry the next 4 attacks)
Bork has weapon skill buff (+% some parry)

And dont forget BG also has Anger Drives Me. An easy 30% parry that's ever present. Doesn't make BG any better for it though. More defense isn't what any tank need. The problem is how to create diversity.

I don't see why people yell ''nerf this ! Don't nerf that !'' To me all this has nothing to do with nerf or not, just how can we make all tanks desirable in a lot of different group comp.

[gandresch]

I played all order tanks in ror and i do understand that auras needs a change.
But if you bring them in line with the SM or IB buffs you need to bring there damage in line aswell.
The knight even with runefang has terrible damage and is way behind the SM and IB damage. The SM does to much dmg for a tank in my eyes and that should be looked aswell once auras got a nerf.

[Toldavf]

The only reason they need a change is because they are so brain dead to use. Further mechanics will be added relating to their use at some point i reckon.

[spikespiegel84]

The only reason they need a change is because they are so brain dead to use. Further mechanics will be added relating to their use at some point i reckon.

This is something I totally agree with, but just for fun. The simple reason why lots of people pick chosen is cause is totally badass. 200 kg of muscles, iron and hate. If I'd play the way I want with the results I want, I'd play black orc.