Fortress siege + gold bag rolling feedback.

[Solutar]

I think a solution to bring high end Players into the normal zones again, so they dont just wait till fort deff, is to grive them contribution for fort fights that happen in the same Zone.

So as example: a Marauder rr 77 with full opressor fights in Dragonwake and eataine, after destro lost/won the last Zone(im not sure if eataine is last Zone before order or destro fort) the fort Comes up, and because the marauder was Fighting in the zones before he had to defend/attack the fort he gets a bigger Chance of Winning a bag !IF! his realm wins the fort.

Thats my idea, ty for reading.


Solutar.

[Tesq]

I've read much of the thread and ppl seems to miss the point and much of the issues related to forts

1- attacking side is just too easy

Flags taking with numerical number in open space? Yummy when you have number advantage; in theory defenders have a central building which thay can use as hq but in practise due : the offensive wb circling around, how much the flags are near each other and the simple fact that even if defenders try to push they will after a while face a constant increasimg number of enemy and most of time off side will be the one to flank and not be flanked...with also part off side killed just back in action in front of main gate....
Thus Make the system full of flaw, the system is way too semplicistic (it does not have to do with too few thing to do but rather very simple or better say poor ( incredible poor) logic on the conseguences of player interaction with the enviroment at hand.
Yet so even being fun is flaw as hell and the advantage are too televant in the next step it should be just a hard fight for a small benefith in next step ( you need to earn it more even if is few; aka lord life is a joke with this system).

Another problem may be that full moral push with number advantage with higher number in last step = win
If 2 sides are equally skilled offensive will win every single time point. It is destinated to be that way from the beginnig like this.

A final problem is the ress, if off side spot is unguarded wipe in some part of citadel (especialy the 2 flag near mid gate ) basiaclly is like have choppa self ress tactic....but an auto version of it...that is not = dying......and there is no loss if that happen which make some part of map easier to guards than other and of course multiple WBs management imcredible eaaier for off side.

Now, how to deal with those problems? First thing first respawn need to be inside a barrier type of wc which let enter back im fight only x ppl every x sec/min in front of main gate. This will create a lapse of time for defender to make use to face higher number or multiple wb in row with more breaks.
Change flags to reset immidiatly if no one is there atm ALL off side is continusly otm which makw imp for def side get an opening. Move the flag approach to extremly dynamic to more static will give more opening to defenders.


2- loot is just lame

Make it separate at least, there is no point
otherwise

3- to incetivise ppl to not let go last zone create a reservation spot for them too in citadel def and an addition contribution for citadel defense loot roll ( this way the incentive can only be claimed in citafel def but since roll is not personal this create interest in def as it create a fight for gear inside realm

[Xergon]

Spoiler:

I've read much of the thread and ppl seems to miss the point and much of the issues related to forts

1- attacking side is just too easy

Flags taking with numerical number in open space? Yummy when you have number advantage; in theory defenders have a central building which thay can use as hq but in practise due : the offensive wb circling around, how much the flags are near each other and the simple fact that even if defenders try to push they will after a while face a constant increasimg number of enemy and most of time off side will be the one to flank and not be flanked...with also part off side killed just back in action in front of main gate....
Thus Make the system full of flaw, the system is way too semplicistic (it does not have to do with too few thing to do but rather very simple or better say poor ( incredible poor) logic on the conseguences of player interaction with the enviroment at hand.
Yet so even being fun is flaw as hell and the advantage are too televant in the next step it should be just a hard fight for a small benefith in next step ( you need to earn it more even if is few; aka lord life is a joke with this system).

Another problem may be that full moral push with number advantage with higher number in last step = win
If 2 sides are equally skilled offensive will win every single time point. It is destinated to be that way from the beginnig like this.

A final problem is the ress, if off side spot is unguarded wipe in some part of citadel (especialy the 2 flag near mid gate ) basiaclly is like have choppa self ress tactic....but an auto version of it...that is not = dying......and there is no loss if that happen which make some part of map easier to guards than other and of course multiple WBs management imcredible eaaier for off side.

Now, how to deal with those problems? First thing first respawn need to be inside a barrier type of wc which let enter back im fight only x ppl every x sec/min in front of main gate. This will create a lapse of time for defender to make use to face higher number or multiple wb in row with more breaks.
Change flags to reset immidiatly if no one is there atm ALL off side is continusly otm which makw imp for def side get an opening. Move the flag approach to extremly dynamic to more static will give more opening to defenders.


2- loot is just lame

Make it separate at least, there is no point
otherwise

3- to incetivise ppl to not let go last zone create a reservation spot for them too in citadel def and an addition contribution for citadel defense loot roll ( this way the incentive can only be claimed in citafel def but since roll is not personal this create interest in def as it create a fight for gear inside realm

Flag phase, as defender u can aproach 2 ways, move as blob faster than enemy blob from flag to flag OR guarrilla-war which means small groups (6man) hiding/kiting and capping flags when blob move out, attack different flags same time, if enemy Blob they can't be everywhere same time. So it's only on Defenders what path they choice, still even if they wont fight for flags, which means that Fort Lord will be weak, they still have huge advantage defending in Lord Room, but to make it work they need to react properly when enemy push in. It's basically morale battle, who utilize their morales better and coordinate bomb/dumb and who has better composition/setup will win.

[Tesq]

Spoiler:

I've read much of the thread and ppl seems to miss the point and much of the issues related to forts

1- attacking side is just too easy

Flags taking with numerical number in open space? Yummy when you have number advantage; in theory defenders have a central building which thay can use as hq but in practise due : the offensive wb circling around, how much the flags are near each other and the simple fact that even if defenders try to push they will after a while face a constant increasimg number of enemy and most of time off side will be the one to flank and not be flanked...with also part off side killed just back in action in front of main gate....
Thus Make the system full of flaw, the system is way too semplicistic (it does not have to do with too few thing to do but rather very simple or better say poor ( incredible poor) logic on the conseguences of player interaction with the enviroment at hand.
Yet so even being fun is flaw as hell and the advantage are too televant in the next step it should be just a hard fight for a small benefith in next step ( you need to earn it more even if is few; aka lord life is a joke with this system).

Another problem may be that full moral push with number advantage with higher number in last step = win
If 2 sides are equally skilled offensive will win every single time point. It is destinated to be that way from the beginnig like this.

A final problem is the ress, if off side spot is unguarded wipe in some part of citadel (especialy the 2 flag near mid gate ) basiaclly is like have choppa self ress tactic....but an auto version of it...that is not = dying......and there is no loss if that happen which make some part of map easier to guards than other and of course multiple WBs management imcredible eaaier for off side.

Now, how to deal with those problems? First thing first respawn need to be inside a barrier type of wc which let enter back im fight only x ppl every x sec/min in front of main gate. This will create a lapse of time for defender to make use to face higher number or multiple wb in row with more breaks.
Change flags to reset immidiatly if no one is there atm ALL off side is continusly otm which makw imp for def side get an opening. Move the flag approach to extremly dynamic to more static will give more opening to defenders.


2- loot is just lame

Make it separate at least, there is no point
otherwise

3- to incetivise ppl to not let go last zone create a reservation spot for them too in citadel def and an addition contribution for citadel defense loot roll ( this way the incentive can only be claimed in citafel def but since roll is not personal this create interest in def as it create a fight for gear inside realm

Flag phase, as defender u can aproach 2 ways, move as blob faster than enemy blob from flag to flag OR guarrilla-war which means small groups (6man) hiding/kiting and capping flags when blob move out, attack different flags same time, if enemy Blob they can't be everywhere same time. So it's only on Defenders what path they choice, still even if they wont fight for flags, which means that Fort Lord will be weak, they still have huge advantage defending in Lord Room, but to make it work they need to react properly when enemy push in. It's basically morale battle, who utilize their morales better and coordinate bomb/dumb and who has better composition/setup will win.

As said you dont have to zerg/blob you just have all wb spread and move circling and even if def side zerg 1 flag the result is still off side have in few equal numbers and after a while superior number

[Tesq]

Spoiler:

I've read much of the thread and ppl seems to miss the point and much of the issues related to forts

1- attacking side is just too easy

Flags taking with numerical number in open space? Yummy when you have number advantage; in theory defenders have a central building which thay can use as hq but in practise due : the offensive wb circling around, how much the flags are near each other and the simple fact that even if defenders try to push they will after a while face a constant increasimg number of enemy and most of time off side will be the one to flank and not be flanked...with also part off side killed just back in action in front of main gate....
Thus Make the system full of flaw, the system is way too semplicistic (it does not have to do with too few thing to do but rather very simple or better say poor ( incredible poor) logic on the conseguences of player interaction with the enviroment at hand.
Yet so even being fun is flaw as hell and the advantage are too televant in the next step it should be just a hard fight for a small benefith in next step ( you need to earn it more even if is few; aka lord life is a joke with this system).

Another problem may be that full moral push with number advantage with higher number in last step = win
If 2 sides are equally skilled offensive will win every single time point. It is destinated to be that way from the beginnig like this.

A final problem is the ress, if off side spot is unguarded wipe in some part of citadel (especialy the 2 flag near mid gate ) basiaclly is like have choppa self ress tactic....but an auto version of it...that is not = dying......and there is no loss if that happen which make some part of map easier to guards than other and of course multiple WBs management imcredible eaaier for off side.

Now, how to deal with those problems? First thing first respawn need to be inside a barrier type of wc which let enter back im fight only x ppl every x sec/min in front of main gate. This will create a lapse of time for defender to make use to face higher number or multiple wb in row with more breaks.
Change flags to reset immidiatly if no one is there atm ALL off side is continusly otm which makw imp for def side get an opening. Move the flag approach to extremly dynamic to more static will give more opening to defenders.


2- loot is just lame

Make it separate at least, there is no point
otherwise

3- to incetivise ppl to not let go last zone create a reservation spot for them too in citadel def and an addition contribution for citadel defense loot roll ( this way the incentive can only be claimed in citafel def but since roll is not personal this create interest in def as it create a fight for gear inside realm

Flag phase, as defender u can aproach 2 ways, move as blob faster than enemy blob from flag to flag OR guarrilla-war which means small groups (6man) hiding/kiting and capping flags when blob move out, attack different flags same time, if enemy Blob they can't be everywhere same time. So it's only on Defenders what path they choice, still even if they wont fight for flags, which means that Fort Lord will be weak, they still have huge advantage defending in Lord Room, but to make it work they need to react properly when enemy push in. It's basically morale battle, who utilize their morales better and coordinate bomb/dumb and who has better composition/setup will win.

As said you dont have to zerg/blob you just have all wb spread and move circling like a clock and even if def side zerg 1 flag the result is still off side have in few equal numbers and after a while superior number

[Xergon]

How to properly execute push into Fortress Lord Room.


Click here to watch on YouTube

[Hienny]

Weird on Order the Lord is running around outside of his Room wiping the Wb's Right after Big Ramp.

[Rockalypse]

Many things were said, with alot I agree, with some I don't. Here are some probable solutions to make 2nd stage something more than lazy roaming and waiting (yes you can push out as defender, but what matters is - last several seconds before gates fall, and if they do and you wipe outside - defenders are done):
1) Make barrage work both ways - Defenders start with all flags capped and rain of fire is released upon attackers every minute until attackers take half of flags - than it turns around. This will help with numerical disadvantage of defenders as coordinated push during barrage can be letal. (barrage can even work from get go - stagee 1, simulating something battle-like, instead of just plain waiting)
2) Create fortress generals - instead of plain BO cap leave hero of 1\2 keep lord strength there to be kiled before BO appears (same as keep cap). It will again give defenders more window to do something with attackers, as some of them will be pushed to hold aggro and etc.
3) Siege weapons for defenders - oil, and etc, as was mentioned before, yes walls give advantage to defenders, but against coordinated push only such tools will actually make difference, when you have 40v60 people in tank m4, 60 will always win.

[Drysill]

After couple fort sieges, these are the things I suggest:

It is one thing 96 vs 76 + 1 lord, and completely another 50 vs 40 + 1 lord. When population is low, defenders always win easily. You can see that. Make Lord scale with population.

The best way to get gold bag if you are in defending realm, its not to actually defend the lord.. its to camp spawn location of attackers and inta kill them over and over…. Do that and BiS gear is yours.. Instead there should be negative contribution on that cowards and take back the gear…

Attackers should get at least 12 gold bags as its far more difficult to kill than to defend lord

Finally, is there stacking contribution on each roll for bags? Like the rest T4 increased chance with each zone?

[Natherul]

After couple fort sieges, these are the things I suggest:

It is one thing 96 vs 76 + 1 lord, and completely another 50 vs 40 + 1 lord. When population is low, defenders always win easily. You can see that. Make Lord scale with population.

The best way to get gold bag if you are in defending realm, its not to actually defend the lord.. its to camp spawn location of attackers and inta kill them over and over…. Do that and BiS gear is yours.. Instead there should be negative contribution on that cowards and take back the gear…

Attackers should get at least 12 gold bags as its far more difficult to kill than to defend lord

Finally, is there stacking contribution on each roll for bags? Like the rest T4 increased chance with each zone?

As stated a few times already, Lords DO already scale, both from the result of stage 2 and from pop.
Bags are not stacking contribution.

Anyway, there is quite a few changes to forts coming this next patch, Im constantly monitoring and making changes as needed.