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Patch Notes 01/07/2020

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Detangler
Posts: 399

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#51 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:20 pm

agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Detangler wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:01 pm
[
Spoiler:
quote=agemennon675 post_id=424710 time=1593632360 user_id=141832]
Spoiler:
I played both sides, this is definetly the case, playing Destro is much easier on every aspect, you never get a full ranged dps scenarios on destro its common on order tho


Thats not the fault of balance or matchmaker, thats too many players choosing to all roll Engies and BWs.
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
[/quote]

Matchmaker picks from whats available. Order players roll ranged disproportionately to other classes as pointed out in other threads on this forum. If all you got is RDPS in queue cause no one plays tanks/mdps, then thats what you're gonna get in your PUG scenario.
Detangler - 40 DoK armor talisman farmer
Deetangler - 40/82 Chosen tankbot/murdermachine
Deeetangler - 40/6x Zealot healbot/talisman factory
Detanglerr - 40/xx Witch Elf boredom killer
Deetsquiggy - 40/x Squig butcherbot
Tanglers - baby Swordmaster

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agemennon675
Posts: 149

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#52 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:24 pm

Detangler wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:20 pm
agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Detangler wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:01 pm
[
Spoiler:
quote=agemennon675 post_id=424710 time=1593632360 user_id=141832]
Spoiler:
I played both sides, this is definetly the case, playing Destro is much easier on every aspect, you never get a full ranged dps scenarios on destro its common on order tho


Thats not the fault of balance or matchmaker, thats too many players choosing to all roll Engies and BWs.
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
Matchmaker picks from whats available. Order players roll ranged disproportionately to other classes as pointed out in other threads on this forum. If all you got is RDPS in queue cause no one plays tanks/mdps, then thats what you're gonna get in your PUG scenario.
[/quote]

Yes, that is exactly why its easier to win get in a warband or party on Destro side because more classes are viable in most cases

Zxul
Posts: 823

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#53 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:26 pm

agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
ASW compared to msh speaking aoe you might have the case, however order has wl. But how exactly WH and engies are weaker than WEs and maguses?
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

agemennon675
Posts: 149

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#54 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:32 pm

Zxul wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:26 pm
agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
ASW compared to msh speaking aoe you might have the case, however order has wl. But how exactly WH and engies are weaker than WEs and maguses?
I dont have high cr/rr WH/WE Engi/Magus but it simply like this WH/WE have same debuffs/buffs with bullets/kisses bullet only procs on executions while kiss have a chance to proc so you can have more uptime on your debuffs, clearly an advantage if you ask me, WE gets to cleave with aoe tactic WH have to hit a target to proc its aoe(That is what I understand from their aoe tactic) Engi mostly does Physical Dmg While magus do magic which have much lower cap(again not a huge difference but still) And Mdps classes: MSH/Mara/Choppa/WE versus WL/ASW/WH/Slayer ask yourself which side have the advantage at viablity in this comparison in any enviroment: City ? Scenarios ? ORvR ? Ranked 6v6 ?
Last edited by agemennon675 on Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Manatikik
Posts: 1125

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#55 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:33 pm

Zxul wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:26 pm
agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
ASW compared to msh speaking aoe you might have the case, however order has wl. But how exactly WH and engies are weaker than WEs and maguses?
Well for AoE they're all even footing with WH > WE due to the way bullets work (just for AoE HD and Wit gives you potential armor debuff).

BUT if we're talking about ST then Magus > Engi due to 75% vs 40% mitigation and the way negative resists scales. WE > WH due to a myriad of things: Taste of Blood alone gives you 15% more damage, the nature of Kisses > Bullets mean they proc more often and do more damage, Witch Brew gives them overall more damage than a normal Execute, and, again, the way resist scaling works means that Kisses and WB do even more increased damage; WE has the highest ST damage in the game.
<Montague><Capulet>

Harrwin
Posts: 11

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#56 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:48 pm

Quite sad to see players of Manatikik caliber joining the nonsense wagon. Bullets proc 100% of finishers and they also do more damage, they also can proc AoE, kisses dont. Does Burn Away Lies not exist anymore?! since you talk about Witchbrew. They have similar damage in ST(WH has the better auto attack speed tactic too btw), but pls tell me when did ST win cities or sieges? Just listen to what Deetangler said, or at least learn the enemy classes, up to date, not this makebelieve nonsense(this reminds me of certain order players whining about mara moral drains when at that point in time, mara no longer had the drain, it was nerfed, so this makes you wonder, how these players are whining about inexistent abilities). Stop with the nonsense before Foofmonger arrives with facts.

Feomatar1
Posts: 37

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#57 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:50 pm

Zxul wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:26 pm
agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
ASW compared to msh speaking aoe you might have the case, however order has wl. But how exactly WH and engies are weaker than WEs and maguses?
Even after buff asw is **** compare to msh in city and orvr, and only better in 6v6. rsw and rsh is comparable. So lol, sh doesnt needs buffs with no nerfs to other destro classes or its strong sides.

Sulorie
Posts: 4871

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#58 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:51 pm

zakgrin wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:35 pm
Are there plans to change WL's snare to type damaging, because the only thing that was mirrored here was duration and cooldown unless that wasn't listed in the patch notes? Marauder's snare is uncleansable, which I thought made up for the fact that WLs had a shorter cooldown and longer duration. So in all honesty Debilitate >>> Cleave Limb, when before it was arguably more balanced. Maybe the goal was to give Marauder's a better snare, but the patch notes seem to indicate it is supposed to be a direct copy pasta of all the other mdps snares.
You recently tested it or just read class builder page, because it was mentioned in some patch notes back in time and might be only a tooltip issue.
Dying is no option.

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Zxul
Posts: 823

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#59 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:55 pm

agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:32 pm
Zxul wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:26 pm
agemennon675 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:04 pm
Well I never said anything about matchmaker but if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege, balance is the main problem if you ask me
ASW compared to msh speaking aoe you might have the case, however order has wl. But how exactly WH and engies are weaker than WEs and maguses?
I dont have high cr/rr WH/WE Engi/Magus but it simply like this WH/WE have same debuffs/buffs with bullets/kisses bullet only procs on executions while kiss have a chance to proc so you can have more uptime on your debuffs, clearly an advantage if you ask me, WE gets to cleave with aoe tactic WH have to hit a target to proc its aoe(That is what I understand from their aoe tactic) Engi mostly does Physical Dmg While magus do magic which have much lower cap(again not a huge difference but still) And Mdps classes: MSH/Mara/Choppa/WE versus WL/ASW/WH/Slayer ask yourself which side have the advantage at viablity in this comparison in any enviroment: City ? Scenarios ? ORvR ? Ranked 6v6 ?
Not familiar with WH/WE enough, but engi has advantages of its own over magus- engi has aa dmg while magus doesn't, also magus has nothing close to engi's Cannon Smash morale.

However- you said that "if those classes; SW's WH's Engis etc. would be as strong as their mirror classes that wouldnt be the case as you can also see in city siege"- fact is, there are lot more engies then maguses. Why is it so, as if as you say magus is stronger than engi?

Not to mention, back to original point- lot more order than destro play rdps, so there are less tanks/mdps for city wbs. If as you say SW's WH's Engis etc are weaker than their mirror classes, why order are playing them over say kotbs/sms/slayers?
"Can we play with him, master? He seems so unhappy. Let us help him smile. Please? Or at least let us carve one on his face when he stops screaming."

— Azeila, Alluress of Slaanesh

Ramlaen
Posts: 76

Re: Patch Notes 01/07/2020

Post#60 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 8:56 pm

Vayra wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:35 pm
Kwatchi wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:29 pm
Kaelang wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:25 pm


Devs are biased because WL's are super OP and haven't been touched in months.

Devs touch WL's and nerf.

'Honestly devs you're biased because you didn't also touch MSH'

-----

The Squig Herder is next in line to get a rework, the WL needed addressing. If it looks like Squig Herders are suddenly dominating because of this WL change, it can be reviewed.


You're the ones who stated in these patch notes that you were bringing all melee dps snares into line and then excluded one. So which is it?
ReturnOfReckoning wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:45 pm
- Cleave Limb (WL): Cooldown increased from 5s to 10s, duration reduced from 10s to 5s. This makes it mirror the snare abilities other mdps get.
SH isn't a melee dps, it's a range dps that has a melee spec. And like they said, SH is next up for changes, if it's too strong it'll get addressed then.
If mSH isn't a melee dps then you would agree that it needs to give up melee dps archetype abilities?
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