Fort Population Cap

[JarlBerzirk]

It's the same thing Order has been complaining about for months in cities, just for a different mode of the game. Order's rdps heavy realm composition makes them better at sieges, especially forts where there is good room for rdps to go absolutely nuts. The fact that Destro hardly ever has solid rdps numbers and instead of that focuses hard on mdps in turn makes them not able to cause the same havoc in forts that Order can. That has nothing to do with actual class balance and everything to do with realm composition.

Different modes require different setups, adjust the setups you bring. Order had to adjust in cities to win them - people quit, had to reroll classes, engis now have to solo Q, etc.

The problem with this mentality that ranged order suck in city is so far from truth its insanity at this point. Couple weeks ago my almost full 24 man premade got completely and utterly obliterated by an order 24 man ranged premade. Our tanks melted like paper. We died faster than we ever have against slayer balls and there was quite literally nothing we could do. Idk where this mentality keeps coming from, because if its working so well in forts for order then it's going to work everywhere else.

[M0rw47h]

This topic wasn't supposed to be about balance, but about people not participating in oRvR leeching endgame rewards. Nothing more, nothing less.

[ChicagoJoe]

It's the same thing Order has been complaining about for months in cities, just for a different mode of the game. Order's rdps heavy realm composition makes them better at sieges, especially forts where there is good room for rdps to go absolutely nuts. The fact that Destro hardly ever has solid rdps numbers and instead of that focuses hard on mdps in turn makes them not able to cause the same havoc in forts that Order can. That has nothing to do with actual class balance and everything to do with realm composition.

Different modes require different setups, adjust the setups you bring. Order had to adjust in cities to win them - people quit, had to reroll classes, engis now have to solo Q, etc.

The problem with this mentality that ranged order suck in city is so far from truth its insanity at this point. Couple weeks ago my almost full 24 man premade got completely and utterly obliterated by an order 24 man ranged premade. Our tanks melted like paper. We died faster than we ever have against slayer balls and there was quite literally nothing we could do. Idk where this mentality keeps coming from, because if its working so well in forts for order then it's going to work everywhere else.

IDK, can't really see how a good destro melee ball loses to order ranged in a city b/c how things stack or DON'T stack. Not sure what happened there but sounds pretty isolated. Ranged will get stomped in a city - so much harder to play that way verses a melee ball.

OP above is right. Order shifted. I haven't played my full sov engi in a city in 9 months. True order pre-mades are really rare, and have been re-optimized for cities. Its mostly experienced discord pug alliance wbs, who try to limit rdps to 2-3 of the total dps in citys, at most.

As a side note, in fortresses order doesn't have to worry too much about magus pulls because people stopped using them b/c choppas were so much easier and better. Order tanks are free to block the doors after the obligatory Blork charge and AOE punt and keep their M4s rather than dying.

I was in the order wb that you referred to that switched. We did have reservations to both but that isn't really worth talking about because they expire quickly.

It was excellent leadership (IMHO the best leader currently) but IT WAS A RISK that we'd sit in que, which some of us did. It was a destro mistake that let us all in, as destro gave up on Stonewatch too early. At Stonewatch destro was completely unorganized. We weren't needed there. It was one strong warband that turned the tide at Reik, creating a jailbreak, not 2-3. Again, even that was carefully done. Leader waited for full WB to get in to create jail break. Inside fortress Destro didn't shift to protect against the smaller near full order group attacking, but stayed on lord and let us in to wipe them. The poison lord mechanic helped us.

It was pretty epic to be in that WB, but again, an isolated incident. Good risks rewarded, mistakes by other side. Happens to both sides.

[ChicagoJoe]

This topic wasn't supposed to be about balance, but about people not participating in oRvR leeching endgame rewards. Nothing more, nothing less.

Seems like this topic was initiated because of some mistakes in an isolated incident.

It may seem as if you've gotten offtopic commentary because you haven't focused on the real issue. Further limiting the total amount won't help destro win forts. If anything it would make it easier for order to defend forts b/c the higher rr folks would dig in and defend.
Destro needs to change tactics/composition to wins forts. This will happen. Good leaders on both sides and some play both sides.

Further limiting fort pop will also hurt the game. We also need population increasing to offset losses, and if people log off b/c they can't get in we are not keeping a player base engaged.

[M0rw47h]

Seems like you know better why the topic was made than author. Those things ain't connected, personaly I don't care which side does WIN forts, I've finished my "invader grind" on 8 characters already and couldn't care less.

[Davjen]

People miss the all point of the 3d as always. The problem is not the population, or other bs that destro/order cry about. The problem is how stupid is that people can literally afk the entire "campaign" to show up the last 10 min to get inside a fort. This discussion is the same for both, attackers and defenders(NO MATTER Wich FACTION). Clearly people talking about overpopulated faction are playing a different game. Destro and Order are balanced in number. It's all about xrealming. Sometimes u have 300 order vs 200 destro, sometimes u have 300 destro vs 200 order.

[ChicagoJoe]

People miss the all point of the 3d as always. The problem is not the population, or other bs that destro/order cry about. The problem is how stupid is that people can literally afk the entire "campaign" to show up the last 10 min to get inside a fort. This discussion is the same for both, attackers and defenders(NO MATTER Wich FACTION). Clearly people talking about overpopulated faction are playing a different game. Destro and Order are balanced in number. It's all about xrealming. Sometimes u have 300 order vs 200 destro, sometimes u have 300 destro vs 200 order.

So you two are effectively arguing that only people in the last zone significantly actively attacking or defending prior to the fort should get access, and lock it there?

Do you really care about some other people joining at the end to "fill" a fort ratio to make it LESS LOPSIDED one way or the other because they get a few invaders? Why care about what others get? This is a PvP based game. You are complaining about too many Ps.

I call BS. It sounds more like you want to zerg a zone and then fortress to win it and you don't want a defense, because that is the outcome that you are advocating.

This game has always been about pushing multiple zones to win one. Repeat. Get City. There is realm based teamwork necessary to make that happen. That is part of what makes this game great.

[CountTalabecland]

To the OP, leeching is by percentage of players the main activity in this game. Despite all the forum try hards, the cast majority of players in game leech in ORvR, leech in Pug scens, and leech in endgame on their poorly geared, no talisman, non-meta classes.

If I didn’t know how much policing the devs do, I would swear these ppl have to be bots to suck this much.

Especially on Order. Order pug city grps are the purest example of this, they would rather exploit the fact that they can get into the city and get 3 medallions per defeat rather than try to improve. Just look at how many premades or 2/2/2 operate in rvr at any given time compared to pugs.

Sad fact is no matter what devs do ppl leech for max reward least effort. Forts would be pretty empty with stricter entry as you suggest. No point in having exclusive ghost towns.

[uberchaoslord]

yeah but order mDPS got buffed to ****, such that its been even for a few weeks on cities (close, which is how it should be, order winning about 40% of the ones I've seen recently).

But we have no chance of winning forts right now. Unless we split push two zones and let the underlevelled/geared people take the first zone, and take the second.

[M0rw47h]

To the OP, leeching is by percentage of players the main activity in this game. Despite all the forum try hards, the cast majority of players in game leech in ORvR, leech in Pug scens, and leech in endgame on their poorly geared, no talisman, non-meta classes.

If I didn’t know how much policing the devs do, I would swear these ppl have to be bots to suck this much.

Especially on Order. Order pug city grps are the purest example of this, they would rather exploit the fact that they can get into the city and get 3 medallions per defeat rather than try to improve. Just look at how many premades or 2/2/2 operate in rvr at any given time compared to pugs.

Sad fact is no matter what devs do ppl leech for max reward least effort. Forts would be pretty empty with stricter entry as you suggest. No point in having exclusive ghost towns.

Nah, they would just have to try to defend keep, and after failing they could continue leeching in the fort. Issue is, people often doesn't even show up in prefort zones when population allows them to. It's mostly bad, because it often causes ghost town until fort right now...