Proposal: Discordant SC Weekly Event

[Everdin]

Why a new event for discordant-weekly? Why no discordant AND grp weekly? Because you suddenly need the premade players to fill up your solo experience?

There is a discordant SC nobodys uses, why creating more effort in this? Solo players don't want the balanced situation, they want fast pops as well and if discordant don't pop they use normal sc que. (Could bet most of them que all from beginning cause they don't care)

Are you even aware that the real good premades are not only stomping cause they are grouped, but also more committed to groupplay and/or their class? They would again spank your ... in a solo mode if there are enough of them, thats why discordant is a mess, the side with the better players stomps the other side. Removing duos from discordant made things worse.

Regarding the archetype inbalance, while in a premade people would maybe care for this issue and someone logg a healer, in discordant you just have anarchy.

...
Other than that I would change the matchmaking so if one of the sides got premade the system wait to find prem on other side then fill with pug other groups on both sides. Or put 2 groups of pugs on both sides. So by that the system should remove the possibility of 2 pug vs prem+pug and you will always got prem + pug vs prem + pug or pug vs pug

When there are no premades on one side due to low pop hours, there won't be any SC pop?

For premade - yes, go solo or duos. It is not perfect but overall it is better than current situation

Again, there is a gamemode premades are excluded from, if you wan't a save spot, go there! If thats not enough for you, your fault, not premades fault.

You all don't want balance, you want punish premades cause you envy them for the rewards. As long as solos prefer the normal grouped sc, the only thing that would bring balance is a good matchmaking or more envoirements like Ironclad where chances are better that you get premade + pug vs premade + pug.

[lemao]

Punish preamdes for grouping up in an MMO, great idea !
Solo players really just dont want to put in any effort, whats new.

[Ashoris]

The complaints are always the same.... premades are the evil for the Solo queuers (i will call them alone queuer To distinct them from the people who queue solo but play as a Teamplayer)...

The Problem are not solo queuers .... but ALONE queuers.
People who refuse to play as a Team and behave as if there is no Team.

a lot of ppl argue'ing here (like Sulorie or Ildaron) play SOLO/duo a lot but they understand the issue is not the solo queuer but the "alone Player".

I can name you multiple solo Players that you can meet in a discordant SC who will behave like a premade without having ever spoken with each other .... because they know how this game is played as a Team (thats how the accusation of abusing the queue comes from most of the time).

This is the real reason - its not premade vs solo Players. its a mindset!

If the Teamplay Mindset Players fight vs the "alone Player mindset" we have a stomp !
It does not make a difference if the "Teamplayer type" is queued solo

[Panzer80]

A very simple solution is to have multiple Discordant SC's that are also for current events and only allow 2 of the archetype classes in each. DPS and heals, or Tanks and DPS for example. Healers really do ruin the fun of most SC's (unpopular opinion, maybe..). I hate to say it but it's true. Everyone loves to see lots of low hp bars, it's exciting. I'm not certain that even premades rolling pugs are having that much fun. Most of the time premades are more of a business decision to get the requirements finished for the "cash prize" SC event. At some point it just becomes a mockery.

[Ashoris]

Healers really do ruin the fun of most SC's (unpopular opinion, maybe..). I hate to say it but it's true. Everyone loves to see lots of low hp bars, it's exciting.

Not exciting will be to realize that this means not low HP bars but more deftard/reggen builds will also dominate the SCs in that case you really havent thought this through.

But hey i guess all the reggen WE's will love it !

[Detangler]

People that form/join premades are of much better skill on average and better geared than the average solo queue pug star. I like having guaranteed tanks and heals on my side, too. Winning is secondary as I just want to have at least 5 competent players on my team that know how to guard/pick targets/assist/heal.

I can't stand how many dps AM/shams never bother to rez, dps that just tab target tanks or spam aoe DD on a blob all by themselves. Its mind boggling how bad some people are at this game.

[trh382]

Imho they should just make discordant have only weekend warfront scenario in its pool during weekends. X

Agree with this - would be a good improvement.

I would consider making it like 66% or 75% chance just so some variety over weekend. But either would be much better than current system where solo players are forced to queue into weekend premades to hit their event.

[trh382]

The complaints are always the same.... premades are the evil for the Solo queuers (i will call them alone queuer To distinct them from the people who queue solo but play as a Teamplayer)...

The Problem are not solo queuers .... but ALONE queuers.
People who refuse to play as a Team and behave as if there is no Team.

a lot of ppl argue'ing here (like Sulorie or Ildaron) play SOLO/duo a lot but they understand the issue is not the solo queuer but the "alone Player".

I can name you multiple solo Players that you can meet in a discordant SC who will behave like a premade without having ever spoken with each other .... because they know how this game is played as a Team (thats how the accusation of abusing the queue comes from most of the time).

This is the real reason - its not premade vs solo Players. its a mindset!

If the Teamplay Mindset Players fight vs the "alone Player mindset" we have a stomp !
It does not make a difference if the "Teamplayer type" is queued solo

I agree with this comment.

Often I see people complaining about a premade when I know for a fact the other side isnt in disc or organized (I can see the dominant DPS in their disc talking with one other person, empty disc, or I was on the stomping side and I know we didnt queue together)

Reality is that organized, competent play is very important and you can achieve a decent level of it just by doing basic mechanical things like positioning, assisting, guard swapping properly

discord organized will still beat pugs, everything else equal, but everything else is almost never equal

[CountTalabecland]

Spoiler:

Because this game isn't made only with group play in mind? You could que solo back in the day you can solo roam you can do tons of things solo. The developers never went out of their way saying "This is the right way to play this game".

If you look almost every skills of support classes (tanks/healers), you will see that their are oriented into group play (for example, AoE heal, guard, morales, ...). Sure, developers never said that grouping is the right way (or solo is the wrong way) to play the game but by design, the game is group oriented, no matter what you think. Of course, you can solo roam, do solo in which game mode you want but it will not change the fact that you'll play automatically with others players at some points (in SC/in RvR), whether you want it or not.

You still don't address any of the issue of someone not having the time or just not wanting to play with others in the moment. There is ZERO downside to allowing solo players to que into a system with other solo players. The only thing it reduces is pugs getting stomped. And at the end of the day that's just permades wanting easy farms.

I think I am adressing this point : if grouping is fast and easy (thanks to tools in game), naturally players will join and leave parties when they have the time to do so. I don't mind grouping someone for 30mn if that allows my team to fill the remaining spot. It is just that a lot of players don't want to have social interactions and use the excuse of time, playstyle, etc ...

I see multiple downside by allowing solo players a weekly event :
- How do you balance PUGs SC ? Do you want it to be random or do you want it to be 2/2/2 ?
- If people are getting stomp in PUGs SC, because the opposite faction has one or two good balanced teams, it will not change the situation you'll see during Weekly SC against premade. So what is the next step ?
- This is development time used for one game mode when there are other game modes that require more attention.

Because I've been having this conversation for years, I've never once had anyone on the other side make a good argument for WHY there shouldn't be pugs. Beyond the "It's meant to be played X way." Which lets be honest, isn't an argument. Maybe someone wants to pop on and play casually? Maybe someone wants to do a SC once or twice and and then log? Why do you not want these people to have that option? It's honestly enraging.

I don't mind people doing SC once or twice and then log off or PUGs. SCs can be here for that. But I don't think Weekly SC should be easier. If you want the rewards from this event, you have to invest a little more than a few SCs here and there. And if I recall correctly, developpers have already say that if you want the rewards for this kind of event, you need to play accordingly.

Lastly the sad thing is already know I'll be replied too with "Well they should just make a group" As if I didn't explain or give reasons as to why this should be an option and way to be able to play the game. I guess I'm not here to pump up my own ego with a permade group crushing solo players and I just care about the game / server health more than most.

The PUGs SC is already here, and I'm not sure it is working that much (since they prevents duo to queue). But I don't see why it should be a Weekly PUG SC. The game became a lot more casual (on some good parts) and I think this is bad to lost more the teamplay aspect by giving more rewards into the PUGs SC.
From my personal experience, Weekly SC can be a lot of harder for the premades, especially when you need to face 2 premades and you have only one, or during 18v18 SC where your faction is pepe. For me, we should try more to raise the level of players on RoR, by making them play more in teams than solo. In this way, players will progress, work more on their team spirit and this will therefore allow for more interesting fights, for each faction.

Let me blow your mind.

Pug Scen does not equal "solo play."

It is a solo QUEUE yes, but you do not PLAY solo. It is a solo Queue to make a Group. You still have to play your toon's archetype and work together in that group. That is not solo play, it just isn't.

Solo is Solo roaming without a group in the lakes. OR, I suppose going alone in a scen in a separate party.

You and people like you need to get past the giant definitional issue your argument has. You make a strawman of the pug as being someone militantly against working together as a team. That is simply not true. Plenty of Pug plays work together in scens, just the same as they do in pug warbands.

There is nothing wrong with solo queue and it should not be punished the way it currently is.

[Gier]

Spoiler:

Because this game isn't made only with group play in mind? You could que solo back in the day you can solo roam you can do tons of things solo. The developers never went out of their way saying "This is the right way to play this game".

If you look almost every skills of support classes (tanks/healers), you will see that their are oriented into group play (for example, AoE heal, guard, morales, ...). Sure, developers never said that grouping is the right way (or solo is the wrong way) to play the game but by design, the game is group oriented, no matter what you think. Of course, you can solo roam, do solo in which game mode you want but it will not change the fact that you'll play automatically with others players at some points (in SC/in RvR), whether you want it or not.

You still don't address any of the issue of someone not having the time or just not wanting to play with others in the moment. There is ZERO downside to allowing solo players to que into a system with other solo players. The only thing it reduces is pugs getting stomped. And at the end of the day that's just permades wanting easy farms.

I think I am adressing this point : if grouping is fast and easy (thanks to tools in game), naturally players will join and leave parties when they have the time to do so. I don't mind grouping someone for 30mn if that allows my team to fill the remaining spot. It is just that a lot of players don't want to have social interactions and use the excuse of time, playstyle, etc ...

I see multiple downside by allowing solo players a weekly event :
- How do you balance PUGs SC ? Do you want it to be random or do you want it to be 2/2/2 ?
- If people are getting stomp in PUGs SC, because the opposite faction has one or two good balanced teams, it will not change the situation you'll see during Weekly SC against premade. So what is the next step ?
- This is development time used for one game mode when there are other game modes that require more attention.

Because I've been having this conversation for years, I've never once had anyone on the other side make a good argument for WHY there shouldn't be pugs. Beyond the "It's meant to be played X way." Which lets be honest, isn't an argument. Maybe someone wants to pop on and play casually? Maybe someone wants to do a SC once or twice and and then log? Why do you not want these people to have that option? It's honestly enraging.

I don't mind people doing SC once or twice and then log off or PUGs. SCs can be here for that. But I don't think Weekly SC should be easier. If you want the rewards from this event, you have to invest a little more than a few SCs here and there. And if I recall correctly, developpers have already say that if you want the rewards for this kind of event, you need to play accordingly.

Lastly the sad thing is already know I'll be replied too with "Well they should just make a group" As if I didn't explain or give reasons as to why this should be an option and way to be able to play the game. I guess I'm not here to pump up my own ego with a permade group crushing solo players and I just care about the game / server health more than most.

The PUGs SC is already here, and I'm not sure it is working that much (since they prevents duo to queue). But I don't see why it should be a Weekly PUG SC. The game became a lot more casual (on some good parts) and I think this is bad to lost more the teamplay aspect by giving more rewards into the PUGs SC.
From my personal experience, Weekly SC can be a lot of harder for the premades, especially when you need to face 2 premades and you have only one, or during 18v18 SC where your faction is pepe. For me, we should try more to raise the level of players on RoR, by making them play more in teams than solo. In this way, players will progress, work more on their team spirit and this will therefore allow for more interesting fights, for each faction.

Let me blow your mind.

Pug Scen does not equal "solo play."

It is a solo QUEUE yes, but you do not PLAY solo. It is a solo Queue to make a Group. You still have to play your toon's archetype and work together in that group. That is not solo play, it just isn't.

Solo is Solo roaming without a group in the lakes. OR, I suppose going alone in a scen in a separate party.

You and people like you need to get past the giant definitional issue your argument has. You make a strawman of the pug as being someone militantly against working together as a team. That is simply not true. Plenty of Pug plays work together in scens, just the same as they do in pug warbands.

There is nothing wrong with solo queue and it should not be punished the way it currently is.

Thank you for saving me time for replying to this. Honestly nothing he said proved anything wrong and you're right. It comes down to the inability to understand that solo queing doesn't mean solo playing. No one ques by themselves and just stays in a group by themselves thats crazy. And if that does happen it's normally because a permade didnt get put it down their own group and leaves that party.

Anyways, permades vs pugs is bad for the servers health, and they've yet to prove me wrong. Heck the only thing they could say is "It would increase que times" but lets be honest que times are already **** what is a little more waiting for a better experience? I feel like if the pro premade group were honest with themselves they'd just admit they like the way it is because it allows them to farm easier and they don't want a challenge.

Cause if I'm being honest before I took my large break I did premades a lot, however if there was ever a permade vs permade group the SC would go the full time and both groups would end up dodging each other because it wasn't efficient towards the end goal of farming crests and RR. So really I can't take these people seriously when they argue in bad faith and treat this issue like some zero sum argument. It simply should be solo/duo pugs vs solo/duo pugs and permades vs permades. Anyone that argues against that only cares about themselves, their ego, and how fast they can farm. Because I promise you you won't see many of these permades in ranked when it relaunches.