BUFF the BG already

[Florian90210]

2h BG is very good.
People complain, but BG is a tank that has 5 tactics.
One is invisible because it doesn't waste a slot on a 10-second cooldown knockback tactic (which is mandatory for others).
IB has the same thing, but it has to carry at least one tactic on Grudge.

No, 2H is garbo. Max you can do is crimson death or ftwk. Tactic for punt also gives snares, BG don't have this option.
Also in casual RvR your punt spam is not priority. Everybody else have really impactful AND easy to use abilities, unlike BG.

Chosen and kotbs are doing too much and too strong right now, so BG and IB should be bringed to level of at least BO and SM. 2H tank should be able to make considerable damage under taunt to make healers use detaunts and to pay attention.

[Alubert]

2h BG is very good.
People complain, but BG is a tank that has 5 tactics.
One is invisible because it doesn't waste a slot on a 10-second cooldown knockback tactic (which is mandatory for others).
IB has the same thing, but it has to carry at least one tactic on Grudge.

No, 2H is garbo. Max you can do is crimson death or ftwk. Tactic for punt also gives snares, BG don't have this option.
Also in casual RvR your punt spam is not priority. Everybody else have really impactful AND easy to use abilities, unlike BG.

Chosen and kotbs are doing too much and too strong right now, so BG and IB should be bringed to level of at least BO and SM. 2H tank should be able to make considerable damage under taunt to make healers use detaunts and to pay attention.

2h BG weak?
No need punt tact.
Great Crimson,
Aoe wounds debuff (no cd, proc on crit)
Aoe avoid debuff.
aoe snare (good cone),
Best punt in the game,
20% crit debuff,
armor debuff.

[Sever1n]

Facepalm. Another circle.

[illumius]

BG is a class that is very dependent on the player's skill, while the other tanks on the destruction side do not require any intelligence from the player. It is necessary to add more risk to the other tanks, forcing them to use a two-handed sword instead of strengthening an already powerful class.

[Detrytus]

No need to buff BG.
Some tweaks maybe for Choking Fury - make ap debuff worth to spec. It was very powerfull on live especially when BG was introduced.
And another fix for Crimson Death. Make it castable on the move like WP Divine Impact, 2 sec cast should be as good like WP ability.

[Farrul]

This discussion derailed with overcomplicated analysis. BG channel was nerfed in a time when BG was a better 2H tank relative to others. This is no longer the case, no reason for BG channel to hit like a wet noodle.

[nocturnalguest]

This discussion derailed with overcomplicated analysis. BG channel was nerfed in a time when BG was a better 2H tank relative to others. This is no longer the case, no reason for BG channel to hit like a wet noodle.

No, its not man. Its just not everyone agree on that. Then there should appear complicated analysis, discussion and then well thought out decision. What happens here is that some people disagree and then others who lobby their wishlists use emotions.

Honest question - BG channel gets increase of its damage (BO numbers as reference) but change its place in mastery tree and only 5 hits, you OK with that? If damage is your concern. And we talk pros, cons, etc.

Each and every tank class suffered from warlord nerf and ws/ini. They all could spec semioffensive, keep tankiness and perform (one expection is kotbs, as its damage mechanic is total crap (was and is now) so its damage is irrelevant so everyone geared kotbs defensively/supporting utility). Not possible anymore as each and every now either taking dps slot, 4 tanks comps, fluffing scoreboard or plays with full ini talis and everything into parry.

None disagreed that BG utility being tied to crit is now somewhat an issue. Nobody want to go into details and discuss it properly here. Tells alot about all this "I demand a buff!" "But why?" "Because i feel so!"

[Farrul]

Listen if BG players want to go in depth and analyse i dont mind it, but considering the OP its really derailed. From my point of view its simple, this thing does no damage unlike the other two destro tank channels, so personally i do not consider it a buff but a restoration to a previous condition.

[Sever1n]

This discussion derailed with overcomplicated analysis. BG channel was nerfed in a time when BG was a better 2H tank relative to others. This is no longer the case, no reason for BG channel to hit like a wet noodle.

No, its not man. Its just not everyone agree on that. Then there should appear complicated analysis, discussion and then well thought out decision. What happens here is that some people disagree and then others who lobby their wishlists use emotions.

Honest question - BG channel gets increase of its damage (BO numbers as reference) but change its place in mastery tree and only 5 hits, you OK with that? If damage is your concern. And we talk pros, cons, etc.

Each and every tank class suffered from warlord nerf and ws/ini. They all could spec semioffensive, keep tankiness and perform (one expection is kotbs, as its damage mechanic is total crap (was and is now) so its damage is irrelevant so everyone geared kotbs defensively/supporting utility). Not possible anymore as each and every now either taking dps slot, 4 tanks comps, fluffing scoreboard or plays with full ini talis and everything into parry.

None disagreed that BG utility being tied to crit is now somewhat an issue. Nobody want to go into details and discuss it properly here. Tells alot about all this "I demand a buff!" "But why?" "Because i feel so!"

About warlord set, untrue. SM and Cho 2h wasnt relying on warlord set, it didnt hit them as hard it hit on phys tanks, especially kotbs whom dont have even own armshred.

Nobody wants to play in your verbal games ( what u keep anoingly doing by trying to put mental markers on others words for public), nor u show even basic understanding of issues of bg and keep spaming your solution of moving channel in trees that will achieve nothing. 1skill should not define all class dmg output, hes all kit must be working properly. Issues with class was listed and showed to you from experienced BGs, but its your own thing that u want to measure things with numbers that can and should be measured by experience. And not providing proofs with metod you demand from others. Before u start to drawn us in some, first ask rigth questions about BG.

Like DMG output of ALL his kit
Value of ALL his utility
How smootly ALL his mechanic and trees working.

Im tired of this nonsense. All feedback what was needed to give to devs about BG was given and i hope they can find sense in there even when some in here obviously failing. If someone have better solutions for class, you are welcome in balance proposals with your own "wishlists".

Without derailing - BG should be buffed? Yes, 100%. Trough buffing channel? Not necessarily, would be a lot healthier to look at all his kit and stats and fix problems, but for some magical reason some people cant see those obvios gaps.

[Sever1n]

https://youtu.be/c4DYLdqm6QY?si=m-pPMGH92LkBgKMM
First car is literally BG, "specialists" say everything fine, but drivers ass tells otherwise, and now bg is standing and smoking.