Frequency of balance patches since the melee rework

[eigner93]

The melee dps rework was released 5 month ago. There were many complains about classes being op or underperforming. And there was only 1 balance patch to adjust a few things. Surely, things are not perfectly balanced. For example my main class the Slayer, probably hit an all time low numbers and barely see them on monthly/weekly killboards. This is just one example and we could be talking about other classes aswell. I know things will never be perfectly balanced, i just wish there were more communication or more frequent balance changes. Because at the moment it feels like focus shifted on item rebalance and ranged dps balance. And i think in a pvp focused game a hands on approach with regular balance patches/adjustments would be ideal instead of one every 6 month. Maybe im wrong or maybe the balance team is too busy with personal life stuff, which is fine this game is a gift to us by the lovely devs, but i am sure atleast a bit more communication would be appriciated by the players.

[Zumos]

Some players might prefer more frequent balance patches. I've also seen the sentiment that less frequent patches are preferred.

Quite some ago the decision was made to have less frequent, but larger balance patches where we go through all the archtypes one by one. We released the MDPS patch and then afterwards another patch to refine the initial changes.

In general I believe that meta requires some time to shape and develop and therefor I'm not a fan of too frequent updates either, unless there is a very clear outlier.

We are currently working on the RDPS balance patch. I can understand that it feels like it takes a long time. The process of working on the design with a group means a lot of discussions and having those in between real life and actually playing the game (not unimportant when making balance decisions) just takes a lot of time. We also share our designs with a selected Focus group, which is great for quality control, but does also take time.

[eerthion]

Some players might prefer more frequent balance patches. I've also seen the sentiment that less frequent patches are preferred.

Quite some ago the decision was made to have less frequent, but larger balance patches where we go through all the archtypes one by one. We released the MDPS patch and then afterwards another patch to refine the initial changes.

In general I believe that meta requires some time to shape and develop and therefor I'm not a fan of too frequent updates either, unless there is a very clear outlier.

We are currently working on the RDPS balance patch. I can understand that it feels like it takes a long time. The process of working on the design with a group means a lot of discussions and having those in between real life and actually playing the game (not unimportant when making balance decisions) just takes a lot of time. We also share our designs with a selected Focus group, which is great for quality control, but does also take time.

I believe the balance between two options is necessary. Big chunk of balance changes are better in general, because it shakes the community, initiates numerous discussions about builds, setups etc etc etc. Which is a great for player interest and retention.

Howerver huge balance changes are always not optimal (they can't be). So some classes/items/skills/whatever always end up being over/under performing. And locking this state for months or years before the next huge patch touches those changes again feels like a disaster.

[lumpi33]

Id prefer pair by pair. BW/Sorc, SW/SH, engi/magus, ....

Pairs fulfill the same roles and should be roughly even.

[live4treasure]

Big, infrequent changes, that have been thoroughly tested; with small hotfixes and rebalances shortly after some important problematic aspect was found (such as the choppa/slayer situation some time ago) is the best way to do it.

[AxelF]

In general I believe that meta requires some time to shape and develop and therefor I'm not a fan of too frequent updates either, unless there is a very clear outlier.

So your belief is that there is currently no clear outlier in terms of melee classes?

[eigner93]

Some players might prefer more frequent balance patches. I've also seen the sentiment that less frequent patches are preferred.

Quite some ago the decision was made to have less frequent, but larger balance patches where we go through all the archtypes one by one. We released the MDPS patch and then afterwards another patch to refine the initial changes.

In general I believe that meta requires some time to shape and develop and therefor I'm not a fan of too frequent updates either, unless there is a very clear outlier.

We are currently working on the RDPS balance patch. I can understand that it feels like it takes a long time. The process of working on the design with a group means a lot of discussions and having those in between real life and actually playing the game (not unimportant when making balance decisions) just takes a lot of time. We also share our designs with a selected Focus group, which is great for quality control, but does also take time.

Thanks for the reply and clarifying a few things. I am a casual player nowadays, but there are a lot of dedicated players/guilds who invest a lot of time in this game. And even with the population being lower than it used to be, i believe the meta shapes up quicker than people think after a big change. Class population numbers compared to numbers before the patch clearly indicate, which classes are being enjoyed more than before. This is the reason i brought up Slayer, my main as an example. As their numbers were higher before the patch it seems like, but now they are one of the least played dps classes. You guys introduced lot of changes to the classes and only a few tiny adjustments after in the balance patch. With this less frequent big balance approach in the eye of the community it feels like certain classes were abandoned and wont be touched for a while and some classes were favoured even if its not the case.

So now the item rebalance has begun and it will clearly effect every class. Can we expect any further balance patch that will adjust the melee classes after the item rebalance has finished or we will see additional adjustments after the ranged dps patch drops?

[rorswar]

Big, infrequent changes, that have been thoroughly tested; with small hotfixes and rebalances shortly after some important problematic aspect was found (such as the choppa/slayer situation some time ago) is the best way to do it.

Theoretically, yes. But that's clearly not the case here.

Patches are not well tested, often not shared on the PTS or for a very short period of time, and the feedback from the community is not sought or ignored.

So what we end up with are infrequent big patches that shift the meta, which is fine, but typically push one or two classes too far up or down. There are then no follow-through patches with minor adjustments, so said classes remain imbalanced for months, or in some instances years.

Who in their right mind thought the WE/WH changes were sensible, for example? DPS RP / Zealot are clearly out of whack, and to some extent DPS AM / Shaman. Slayer got changes that were neutral or made it worse, and rarely gets a look-in in WBs. And what's been done about it? The regen meta is completely out of tune, and everone knows it. Why did the WL stay so overtuned for years, that Order ended up with 8x WLs in WBs? Why does BG / IB still not have a clearly defined role?Why has Assault SW been nerfed time after time again, to the point that a handful of people play it? Why do Sorc/BW continue to struggle for years in this meta? The list goes on and on... and all those issues persisted for a long period of time.

By all means, do infrequent big patches to balance out archetypes, but for the love of god put infrequent small balance tweaks in between them so the playerbase doesn't have to suffer outliers for prolonged period of time. So many people quit over this as persistent outliers massively demotivate people, especially those in organised guilds of which there are very few left.