MKT Thoughts and Feedback

[Dabbart]

Hello guys and gals.

Issue: Currently, grabbing the part, and kiting from your spawn to up the stairs pretty much guarantees you a victory. Whether you intend this strat or not is irrelevant. Many times, 6v6 1 side has the advantage, grabs the part then gets pushed when it turns to 12v12. Now, they aren't going to stand there and die, they fall back, towards their spawn, at which point there is normally at least 1 player savvy enough to hop on a cannon after dying. Or, quite simply the winning side's carrier dies, or they are wiped on cannons and the weaker side grabs the part. 1 of 2 things happens at this point.

1, The attacking side has enough heal/tank/dps to hold the temple, but not wipe the enemy, thus remaining unable to grab the part

2, the attacking side gets wiped via cannons and a push. The defenders then hold the temple until they get pushed back again, right as they start to wipe, players respawn and hop on cannons, or simply wave on and on.

Exceptionally rarely is the SC lopsided enough(thankfully) that one side just rolls the other regardless of the cannons. These SCs are the exceptions, since it is irrelevant what you do, 11mdps can't beat a double premade. They can however cleverly grab and sustain the part.

All that is needed is 1-2 clever players to lock down the part, and kite into and out of your spawn zone to accumulate points, albeit slowly. This is NOT any sort of reasoning to allow spawn camping however. If they have any sort of healing/tanks they can sustain this indefinitely.

Suggestion: Change MKT so that if the player holding the part is in their spawn(Outside of the Temple, Temple consisting of all the upper stone Area, with the Ramps being the cutoff) A, Negative points for their realm B, receives double damage, or C, Part resets 30s after leaving the Temple.

Perceived Solution: pushing in and out of the temple should be a strat. Kiting to reinforcements should work. Spawn camping should be deterred. But one side shouldn't be pushed for having enough strength to win, but not wipe the enemy. This SC isn't about holding Flags or a fixed position. It's about holding a part in and around the Temple. If we can establish the gameplay to help facilitate this I believe the SC would perform far better than it does.

Thanks, and I welcome feedback/insults.

[Drudge]

The thing i notice mainly is when one side doninates the other side just gives up. They sit in their spawn and wait for it to end, gimping renown for everyone. Maybe your suggestions would help this.

[DokB]

In my opinion it’s just a very poorly designed map with very little that can be done to stop certain player actions like spawn camping.

Once outside the middle temple, you have a zone which is very easy to hold, very few effective paths to flank around for either side and it is quite literally an uphill battle for the team that wants to push upwards into the enemy team.

Usually the only thing that gets teams to fall back are the spawn cannons, which need to be in place to deter spawn camping. But then where do you draw the line for the cannons range? It needs to push back those people on the high ground but it also needs to avoid unfairly influencing any fights in the middle. I believe there is already a few mechanics in place to stop people from falling back towards their spawn with the flag, one being less points (this might have been replaced however with semi-recent changes) gained and the other being the flag resets if you go to close to your spawn.

Honestly I think that your suggestion is a bit overkill if the cut off zone is just before the ramps for each side. Only the other day we managed to grab the part with an extremely imbalanced team (no healers and everyone else were lowbies) and we managed to steal a few points by hiding out of LOS just at the bottom of our spawns ramp. We were soon flushed out since the other side had a much better team composition. Anything like double damage for being in certain areas is too much IMO, simply having less points for being in certain areas is better since it gives more time for each team to get together and push.

I don’t deny there are some issues with the map, but having certain areas of the map directly affect gameplay with things like double damage is a bit too much. Maybe if they added additional flags to make it more like Maw of Madness then you would get people spread out more and less spawn camping.

[wargrimnir]

There's the other unused half of the map across the bridge that could probably be used for something.

[Aurandilaz]

If devs simply have the energy and the means, I wish they would change MKT into a 3 flag scenarion, similar to that of Nordenwatch.
Because there is really enough room for 3 flags in my opinion.

one main flag at the centre just like Fort at Nordenwatch

2 other flags some distance from each spawn, that give some points, but still less compared to the actual temple building

something like

there partially collapse bridge would be fun place for fighting, and there is some weird empty hut which would be a devilish place to put a flag in.

[Dabbart]

I had an idea awhile back about putting mini-lair bosses in those little cubbies. If the temple proper is considered too restrictive, opening the rest of the map in another way would be an excellent method as well.

We have enough flag SCs. Maybe allow some clickables inside the temple, with a CT that reset's the part. You can hold it where ever, but if you don't control the Temple you wont keep it.

I don't want to incite more griefing, and really don't want to detract from the fundamental SC, which I find quite fun.

[CegeePegee]

To clear things up, this was actually fixed once already but there was an issue with version control that seems to have caused the fix to roll back. I'm investigating this and will hopefully have it resolved soon.