I'm sad WE lost range

[Judarth]

Hello. I'm very sad WE lost 30 ft finishers. WE lost so much game play.

With 30 ft range you was able to kite melee dps when they focus you, like you do less dmg but don't let hit your self, or you can hide under rock from range dps and hit with finisher from cover and when ranges chose other target you go out and build blood lust in melee again. Also range 30 ft range let you avoid oae spam mob dmg (becose it usualy about 25 ft) and keep some pressure, very useful when you play solo and don't have personal tank and healer (I belive most ppl play WE for solo game play). It was like dancing with your enemies you hit few times and kite with Ruthles Assaut or use it from cover. Such unique and amazing game play becose you need choose right time to go melee when you in safe and when enemy start focus you kite again, feels like real dexity character. Jump help only for chase, nothing else.

And WH not only have 30 ft range still, this game play was improved with Incendiary Shot so you can non stop shoot with range finishers and this ability when combine it with Flowing Accusations tactic. It feels very strong for solo game play. May be WE need some range blood lust build ability but not WH ;/

Very confused. Classes were never mirored but you was able to get pretty same game play on both sides... So removing WE range is removing mid range for destro in general. It's like removing magus pet for some reason. And don't tell me WH have gun and WE not. It's fantasy game, It's fantom blades and witch shreding your soul with it or some other crazy thing wich we like in fantasy. WE can throw daggers if you like realism.

I understand WE have more dmg and bla bla bla but game play become more poor. You just spam Agonizing Wounds and then you have Grand Agonizing wound finisher Sacrifitial Stab. And if you cant Agonize you jump. Hope for some changes other wise see on my WH

[gersy]

a lot of WE hate on the forums atm but actually all good WE i spoke with think the patch was mostly buffs (i mean good 6-12man party players not solo 1v1ers and gankers since their opinion is not valid as the game is not balanced around this, sorry). elixir no longer sharing cooldown, 30 second combo points, feinted working on throw dagger, elixir of shadows allowing restealth without breaking temporary invis and +1 seconds, dance of doom m1 rework, increased pain tactic available without mastery, heartrender as a generator instead of spender and opener buffed to give +10% crit chance from behind, etc. are all buffs.

i think the changes are fine (both to WH and WE). players must learn to adapt to the everchanging balance of the game and find new strategies with new tools they are being given instead of complaining constantly.

[Krima]

a lot of WE hate on the forums atm but actually all good WE i spoke with think the patch was mostly buffs (i mean good 6-12man party players not solo 1v1ers and gankers since their opinion is not valid as the game is not balanced around this, sorry). elixir no longer sharing cooldown, 30 second combo points, feinted working on throw dagger, elixir of shadows allowing restealth without breaking temporary invis and +1 seconds, dance of doom m1 rework, increased pain tactic available without mastery, heartrender as a generator instead of spender and opener buffed to give +10% crit chance from behind, etc. are all buffs.

i think the changes are fine (both to WH and WE). players must learn to adapt to the everchanging balance of the game and find new strategies with new tools they are being given instead of complaining constantly.

Sure, but as OP said: WH can currently play both styles: an “in-your-face” spec like WE with Torment/BAL–EW, and still keep some ranged pressure through EW + Absolution. Even a full ranged spec with Confession, DG, and Trial by Pain still keeps its range.

I don’t have my WH anymore, but is there really a good reason to lower OYK damage and reduce RA range? Also, how does the base damage compare between those two skills?

Meanwhile, WEs are forced into "In your face" builds, mostly spamming AW + something else. I don’t understand how they evaluated finisher range, because it’s a huge deal that all WE finishers are being reduced to 5 ft. Whats the trade off?

Also, 30 ft finishers are very newbie-friendly, they help players with high ping or lower skill. AW + SS may have the DPS, but overall WE is losing a fun and accessible spec: Carnage.

[Sever1n]

Dunno why WE so obsesed with nerf of brutal. You still have boxing dot build with witchbrew, i dont even know who used oyk ws build now after ruination of 25% pene buff. Long figths brew, fast busrt SS. WEs was able to do huge burst before rework, i eated 2.1k crits from AW. Isnt new opener critbuff - woundcutter - stun - x2 AW - SS = toxic death in one stun? And brew build with wound cutter now even more toxic.

But yes 1st tree is huge mess after patch, instead of fixing it its now just makes no sense. Im trying figure out how boxing armpen buld looks for wh and i just dont see it. And channel skills that drop middle cast tnx to range also big pain that needed fix long time ago, for all classes.

[Faction69]

I play WH not WE but I do agree. Yes yes, WH finishers are 30 yards because WH has guns. But from a balance perspective it's just such a big difference between the two classes. It seems like a weird thing to have changed when there are so many other more important things that make regen WE OP that could have been nerfed

[Mvl130]

30ft range finishers felt like supreme bullshit and was one of the main reasons I did not enjoy WE, as this just felt like a cheap mirroring tweak instead of an element of gameplay proper to the class ; there is no need to obsessively mirror classes, however it is possible that Witch Elf lacks of something to make it more singular.

WH with its pistol has increased range on some abilities, which makes senses, unlike idiotic telekinetic daggers, but then something should be unique to the Witch Elf class to make up for that, and I don't know what it could be exactly

[Stinksuit]

30ft range finishers felt like supreme bullshit and was one of the main reasons I did not enjoy WE, as this just felt like a cheap mirroring tweak instead of an element of gameplay proper to the class ; there is no need to obsessively mirror classes, however it is possible that Witch Elf lacks of something to make it more singular.

WH with its pistol has increased range on some abilities, which makes senses, unlike idiotic telekinetic daggers, but then something should be unique to the Witch Elf class to make up for that, and I don't know what it could be exactly

While I understand the argument that wh uses pistols for finishers etc and WE has daggers. This whole thing goes down the drain (imo) when you introduce "Broad severing" (slice aoe tactic) that hits all enemies to 25ft infront of you...

I am not give my opinion on the matter whether the range change is good or bad but the "explanation/reasoning" just doesnt work due to the aoe slice hitting 24 people at once and it also having range to it..

[Krima]

30ft range finishers felt like supreme bullshit and was one of the main reasons I did not enjoy WE, as this just felt like a cheap mirroring tweak instead of an element of gameplay proper to the class ; there is no need to obsessively mirror classes, however it is possible that Witch Elf lacks of something to make it more singular.

WH with its pistol has increased range on some abilities, which makes senses, unlike idiotic telekinetic daggers, but then something should be unique to the Witch Elf class to make up for that, and I don't know what it could be exactly

Sure, if we go by the book, daggers can be thrown.

So let’s assume WHs have pistols, which gives them range on their finishers, and WEs don’t get that because they use daggers. Then why are the skills mirrored?
TBP = RA, Absolution = Puncture… same base damage and same formula, but the range isn’t the same?

So a pistol does the same damage as a deep stab with a dagger?

Fine, let WHs keep their range, but WEs should have higher damage or something else, since, realistically, it’s a 30 cm dagger going straight in.

[M0rw47h]

30ft range finishers felt like supreme bullshit and was one of the main reasons I did not enjoy WE, as this just felt like a cheap mirroring tweak instead of an element of gameplay proper to the class ; there is no need to obsessively mirror classes, however it is possible that Witch Elf lacks of something to make it more singular.

WH with its pistol has increased range on some abilities, which makes senses, unlike idiotic telekinetic daggers, but then something should be unique to the Witch Elf class to make up for that, and I don't know what it could be exactly

While I understand the argument that wh uses pistols for finishers etc and WE has daggers. This whole thing goes down the drain (imo) when you introduce "Broad severing" (slice aoe tactic) that hits all enemies to 25ft infront of you...

I am not give my opinion on the matter whether the range change is good or bad but the "explanation/reasoning" just doesnt work due to the aoe slice hitting 24 people at once and it also having range to it..

Yeah, and same tactic let WH turn his pistol into machine gun?

[Stinksuit]

30ft range finishers felt like supreme bullshit and was one of the main reasons I did not enjoy WE, as this just felt like a cheap mirroring tweak instead of an element of gameplay proper to the class ; there is no need to obsessively mirror classes, however it is possible that Witch Elf lacks of something to make it more singular.

WH with its pistol has increased range on some abilities, which makes senses, unlike idiotic telekinetic daggers, but then something should be unique to the Witch Elf class to make up for that, and I don't know what it could be exactly

While I understand the argument that wh uses pistols for finishers etc and WE has daggers. This whole thing goes down the drain (imo) when you introduce "Broad severing" (slice aoe tactic) that hits all enemies to 25ft infront of you...

I am not give my opinion on the matter whether the range change is good or bad but the "explanation/reasoning" just doesnt work due to the aoe slice hitting 24 people at once and it also having range to it..

Yeah, and same tactic let WH turn his pistol into machine gun?

Kinda yeah.. I havent played my wh at all after the changes and WE only few times to give any balance opinions but as soon as I heard the "reason" of one having gun and one having dagger I just instantly thought that its a bit of a poor explanation due to WE having access to the ranged aoe spammable but oh well.