General Suggestions and Feedback

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Uchoo
Posts: 547

General Suggestions and Feedback

Post#1 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 6:32 am

Hello,

First of all, I would like to thank your team for the effort you have put into this project, you have done very well and it has grown quickly, that would have never been possible without your immense efforts. I would also like to take a moment to praise your general attitudes toward balance and the state of the game. I noticed that one of your lead devs plays a Swordmaster, I found that funny. :P

To business. You guys have said not to speak of anything that would use your time and efforts without any impactful gains, so I am only going to mention things that I think will truly put the game on pace, speaking as a person who played this game for 4 years during live. Disclaimer: what I am saying is an opinion, albeit hopefully grounded well in a foundation of fact, feel free to add your own thoughts as a community.

1: Scenario parties and general bug issues with unit frames. In a scenario, at times, you cannot join a party and sometimes your unit frame bugs out to show you as dead or maybe you are actually showing the health of someone else in a party. For less experienced healers, this is almost crippling; for others, it's annoying and costing a death for no real reason. Fixing this would make the game more playable and enjoyable, as I'm sure you know.

2: The "M" key bugging out. I personally hate when I can't view the map, as I use this to constantly gauge enemy position and to help solicit strategy. Without it, I feel naked and blind. Sometimes /reload fixes, sometimes relogging fixes it. However, a lot of the time, neither fixes it.

3: Sorcerer/Bright Wizard output. This has been one of the most hotly debated topics in Warhammer since day 1 so I'm going to try to keep this in direct context. In the lower tiers, it can be incredibly gruesome. At level 8 with Fiery Blast and Shattered Shadows, they can bomb an entire team for 400, 500, even the rare 600. It is almost impossible to deal with this as healers and if you don't have an easy way to deal with the mages when they start spamming, you will lose the battle of attrition in 10 seconds or less. This is further compounded with the Boiling Blood and Word of Pain tactics. I have had Boiling Blood consistently hit me in the 1500 to 1600 range in the 22-26 tier, with 1000 being around average in the 12-21 tier. At this level, it is very hard to get any amount of corp resist, especially with the BiS 26 gear, it has very little. And I believe the typical Bombardier spec Engi at 26 has a 255 corp debuff, which leaves you at 0. I fear this issue may be worse in tier 3 when the mages are very likely to be running the corp and spirit debuff tactics in their 3rd tactic slot, though I do not remember how the resists look on the gear at that point. It is not very hard for a Sorc/BW to burst in the 4k range inside of a single global cooldown, which is very, very difficult to survive for most people.

A lot of scenarios I play in and general RvR, the winner tends to be the side that hits the critical mass of Sorc/Bright Wizard. On the opposite end of the spectrum, when we have games without Bright Wizard or Sorc, or when they run a bomb spec, they're actually pretty fun and engaging scenarios. If even 2 Sorc/Bright Wizard are focusing a single target, that person is about to have a very bad day. Even worse, in the quite common situation in which that target already has a few Curses/Hexes/Ailments on them, trying to cleanse a mage rotation to save their life becomes daunting, even for 2 dedicated healers.

I think that including gear with a more reasonable offering of resists at this level (30% to everything) would be good and would avoid having to change the classes at all until you have decided if and how you want to balance them.

Food for thought, thanks for your time.
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Tiggo
Former Staff
Posts: 1948

Re: General Suggestions and Feedback

Post#2 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 8:13 am

bugs need to go into the bugtracker.

balancing: Well nothing new you told actually... but actually you CAN have a lot of spirit resistance on order or elemental on destro, but then you wont max your other stats. And thats the point, people max out their damage stats and then complain not having enough defensive stats at the same time, thus getting lots of damage from sorc/bw. BTW: arent there resistance talismans there now? perhaps change some str. talismans for them?

I see marauders where a fireball crits for 300 max and i have 740 int ... so it IS possible to not die from bws in seconds ^^
(then there is guard, buffs, pots etc.).

on the 4k in one GCD: NO you dont get it in one gcd, it needs the bw/sorc rather like 3 gcd to put this dmg on you at the end, of course you dont see that ... (and 4k is quite exagerated, more like 2k max WHEN all crits).

finally, you NEED high damage burst clases in this game or nothing will die!

Adressing AOE damage is a different beast i agre though. But single damage is totally in line on mages (both sides) AOE damage and healing needs to be looked at for ALL classes or the meta game.
- Martock - Tiggo - Antigonos - Mago - Hamilkar - Melquart
- Smooshie (Destro)

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Jaycub
Posts: 3130

Re: General Suggestions and Feedback

Post#3 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 8:35 am

It's not BW/Sorc, in SC's it's all about having proper 2-2-2 setups (ideally)

If you find yourself in an SC with 5 BW 1 knight and 6 WP vs a team that has like 4 tanks and 2 mdps/mara you will just fold like paper because you have no frontline/guard etc...

The biggest gripe I have with SC's is there is no que role system for pugs, even with people running clowny builds like FA tanks or DPS healers, it would be astronomically better than the lottery we have now.

And before you say "just form a premade" realize that SC's are 12 mans, so even if you form the perfect premade you might get into a scenario and your pug group is 4 bw and 2 wh and its automatically over if the other side has a balanced composistion.
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Tiggo
Former Staff
Posts: 1948

Re: General Suggestions and Feedback

Post#4 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 9:22 am

Jaycub wrote:It's not BW/Sorc, in SC's it's all about having proper 2-2-2 setups (ideally)

If you find yourself in an SC with 5 BW 1 knight and 6 WP vs a team that has like 4 tanks and 2 mdps/mara you will just fold like paper because you have no frontline/guard etc...

The biggest gripe I have with SC's is there is no que role system for pugs, even with people running clowny builds like FA tanks or DPS healers, it would be astronomically better than the lottery we have now.

And before you say "just form a premade" realize that SC's are 12 mans, so even if you form the perfect premade you might get into a scenario and your pug group is 4 bw and 2 wh and its automatically over if the other side has a balanced composistion.

role based sc wont work perfectly but would be a improvement for sure.

and yes i really really really want ONE just ONE 6man SC pleeasseeeee ;)
- Martock - Tiggo - Antigonos - Mago - Hamilkar - Melquart
- Smooshie (Destro)

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Uchoo
Posts: 547

Re: General Suggestions and Feedback

Post#5 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 3:44 pm

Destro don't have a corp resist tactic, Chaos have Elemental. Even the fact that different races have different resist tactics is very poor balance. I think every race should have all 3 tacs, to slot at their choosing. I'll say it again, my 26 DoK in almost BiS gear with 2 +30 corp resist talis and a corp pot has 257 corp resist.

As for 4k Burst in a global, yes it is very possible. 4k damage HITS the target in one global with the standard burst rotation. 1600 Boiling Blood, 1200 Pyro Surge, 1000 Sear with an Ignite tick hitting right before and right after the global. Worst case scenario is having to cast Withering Heat at the end.

Is being able to kill someone in one global needed in the game? I mean if you ask me I'll just laugh. We ran assist trains and used confusion, tempo and coordinated CC/debuffs to kill targets. I think it's poor design to force someone to be dead with no managable counter.

ROTATION:

Time (sec) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
---------------------------------- 8.5 sec rotation
1 Ignite 1 2 3 X 5 6 X 8 9 X
2 slow boil 1 2 3 4 5 X
---------------------------------- 5.5 sec rotation
3 boil blood 1 2 3 4 5 X
4 Pyro Surge 1 2 TX
5 Burning Iron/Sear 1 X
6 Nova/Withering Heat X

This is your bread and butter burst rotation. The red X's are the damage ticks that matter. Global cooldown in Warhammer is 1.5 seconds.

8.5 sec: Best case scenario, nothing gets cleansed. Everything hits between 7.5 seconds since ignite, to 9 seconds since ignite. Throughout the entire rotation, Ignitition tactic will keep target corporeal resist debuffed. Fuel to the Fire is required for this rotation. T is the half second travel time for Pyro surge. It might feel longer, but it's only half a second. Two of ignite's ticks hit right before and after the main burst combo, at 7 and 10 second mark, if you want to count that damage.

Source: http://warbrightwizard.blogspot.com/
Last edited by Uchoo on Sat Oct 10, 2015 4:03 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Uchoo
Posts: 547

Re: General Suggestions and Feedback

Post#6 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 3:46 pm

Jaycub wrote:
If you find yourself in an SC with 5 BW 1 knight and 6 WP vs a team that has like 4 tanks and 2 mdps/mara you will just fold like paper because you have no frontline/guard etc...

This exact team, all skilled players vs skilled players, the 5 BW would have a hay day. They would not fold like paper lol. Test it.
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